Reptile & Amphibian Forums

All purists, lets rock...

Do your anery rosies come from Morrongo stock?

I think you have to go to the rosy forum to ask that question. LOL!

I would like to talk to you. Call me.

They come from vision herp. The original male was purchased 3 years ago by chad dorton. I do not know what the lacality is, only vision can answer that question.

Thanks, I do believe they look much like

n/p
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"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science." -Charles Darwin

"I am turned into a sort of machine for observing facts & grinding out conclusions"-Charles Darwin

"Man with all his noble qualities, with sympathy which feels for the most debased, with benevolence which extends not only to other men but to the humblest living creature, with his god-like intellect which has penetrated into the movements and constitution of the solar system- with all these exalted powers- Man still bears in his bodily frame the indelible stamp of his lowly origin." -Charles Darwin

"A scientific man ought to have no wishes, no affections, -- a mere heart of stone" -Charles Darwin

"The fact of evolution is the backbone of biology, and biology is thus in the peculiar position of being a science founded on an improved theory, is it then a science or faith?" -Charles Darwin

np

np

Dean,have you noticed that most of these arguments come from 2 people in here?Ive also noticed that these 2 are the only breeders of hybrids here.I emailed one of them asking her about how she get's away with using her companies logo's in here.All i got was a poorly written form letter in return.If this is the future of reptiles,it must be the George Jetson version of it...Paul.

...But with any luck, this trend will fizzle out.
I'm trying to do my part.

I do my best to spread the word to stay away from them to pretty much all herp novices (who seem to be the only people interested in them) ...that I meet.

I just hope they fizzle out before they contaminate the rest of the captive population.

If that happens, then the only way to attain pure strains would be to go back to the wild. I'd hate to see that happen.

Ya know, I havent seen to many purist lining up to donate or give away their animals. Why cant they be breeding them to beautify the hobby? I personally believe that there is room for all types in this hobby: purists, locality, morphs, hybrids...etc. If its an eye popping hybrid or a fantastic pure specimen that sparks an interest in herps, the hobby is better off with another fan. We should be fighting against unfair laws and ignorant prejudices instead of fighting amongst ourselves.
Mike

that the snakes that currently exist are not good enough to attract new blood?

No. Please reread what I said. I used huge generalities but included morphs, normal, locality, and hybrids.

With all the 100's of snakes you can own not to mention color morphs why would you want a hybrid?All you could ever want is allready here.

Maybe all you could want.....I am still waiting for a striped motley sunglow boa, pastel clown ball, and more candy king hybrid variations! But, thats just me.

If you breeding colubrids your not making any real money. If your doing hybrids your definetly not making money. If your breeding quality hybrids you have style. If your whining about hybrids you're not making any money on what ever your doing any way. It is not about money. You want MONEY have the balls to breed ball pythons. Or go back to school. If you are too stupid for that then hit the streets with a box of rubbers. But do not confuse style with greed.

Okay, we've proven you can pretty much cross any two similar species. Why continue? I've seen many hybrids and I think the only reason anyone is attracted to them is because it appears as something new, not because the hybrid is any better than the original species. Just remember that most people that actually observe reptiles in the wild are opposed to intentional hybridization. It's our "purist" attitude that separates us from the people who keep dogs and cats or any of the other animals that have been selectively bred into whatever they want. I have seen quite a few hybrids I liked initially, but when I considered the originals, I realized no hybrid will compare. I am not out to just bash hybrid lovers, and if you want to frankenstein your bloodlines, go ahead and do so. Don't, however, say it is science or herpetology when it is just a plot to manipulate a natural organism into what it wasn't meant to be so you can have the new designer herp of the week. Unless you do something groundbreaking that gains new information that is beneficial to the field as a whole, I wouldn't say you are inventing intergrades in the interest of science.
Disclaimer: I truly feel no hostility towards hybrid guys, I am just excercising my 1st amendment right to voice my opinion, as I'm sure you will do. I think most hybridizers have good intentions, but, if you do encourage hybridization, I would challenge you to evaluate your current stance on the issue and ask yourself how you are contributing to this branch of science.

You just contradicted yourself, made several hypocritical statements and slandered yourself all in one paragraph. Do you really think anyone is going to listen to you or take anything uou have got to say serously?
Read what you wrote and try not doing any of the above and you will do better the next time around.
LOL

I would like to know where I slandered myself, where I contradicted myself, and where I was hypocritical. If you can not tell me, then your statement is invalid.

I have given many hours of thought to the right and wrong of hybridization in snakes.
And would flip flop on my answer many times.. I think the main reason I would flip back and forth
between my answer was because I was looking at it wrong/incorrectly. What we need to remember
and keep in mind when discussing this topic is 1. are we breeding for the reintroduction of the species?
2. are we breeding to maintain genetic "records" of a now extinct animal in the wild?
3. Or are we producing these animals to be kept as pets in non naturalistic homes/enclosures, where they
will live out the rest of there natural lives without contributing anything to the gene pool of the wild
species population.

Well if you are doing 1 or 2 then keeping them pure is vital...but 99.9% of us have not/will not ever breed our
animals for either of these reasons.

That is my thoughts on this all (and this is from someone who doesn't keep any crosses,that I know of. And still
somehow keeps from belittling those who do)

Later Randy T.
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You never experience life until you have kids..then you realize what you should have done rather then what you did do

Try to understand that MOST people breeding hybrids are doing it because they are tired & looking at the tireless numbers of replicas. If you have been around long enough you will become jaded. If you have not great for you. Hybrids for me has nothing to do with money. It is alot deeper than that. Layers of pigment, contrast, & creating something that is going in the direction you want is exiting. In the years to come you will find some of these creations by myself & others to be locked & creating themselves. When this level is reached it will be the young crowd, the future that will not even be concerned with purist views, although they will love natural stuff as well. What I really like to think about is that purists will never reach every young beginner. They are out matched by color,contrast & the power of change.

it's impossible for you to even have seen pictures of the immense number of reptile and amphibian species on the planet. If you think you are experienced enough in herpetology to be "tired" of the existing species, then you are sorely mistaken and indefinately arrogant. In truth there are hundreds of thousands of wonderful creatures that you probably have never even heard of, let alone witnessed as a living specimen. If you want to try something new, there are breeders across the planet who can accomodate you.

Then get me some!!!! Dont talk about it. When is the last time you've been to the florida show or any other. What you're saying is that you & your purists have FAILED. Where are these thousands of creatures. Im sure they exist so go get me some. Step up to the plate, walk the talk or get out of my yard.