Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Is co-habitating even a word?? haha.

Anyway, do any of you ever house any of your females together either as babies,sub-adults, adults or in any case?

It seems like I have heard of some people who do this with no problems and it helps them save on cages. (obviously that is ifF the cage is adequately large enough and has enough secure hiding spots etc for both snakes). I know that this obviously wouldn't be possible with males and I also realize that feeding would need to be done in separate enclosures.

Anyway, would be curios to hear everyones thoughts. I was thinking a really BIG naturalistic type setup would be fun, but I would like to be able to allow more than 1 of my BRBs to enjoy it)

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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

Yes co-habitating is a word.

I breed many of mine in 1.2 groups and the females don't seem to care. If I get two males in there it's like WW3 pushing and shoving each other around. I only separate them after breeding is all done.
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count (02/01/2010):
42.61 BRB
27.40 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I can definitely see why one would want to give females separate enclosures post-breeding and while they're gravid.

My questions really more geared towards figuring out peoples input on raising up 2 females per enclosure until they reach breeding age.....
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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

I agree with Cliff.

My three sticking points are...

1) Keeping them healthy and when intermingled if one gets sick.... Then again I rarely have one get sick so is fairly low risk.

2) Feeding - During breeding season is a real PITA to separate for feeding, know which one is which, feed/record, wait a day or so and re-introduce. IMO a necessary evil and while one I'm totally willing to deal with during breeding season, NOT one I'd like to do long term.

3) Sheds - is also a real PITA tracking sheds while co-habitating. I do record opaque when noticed and that helps along with all three record cards I can usually know fairly quickly which one shed. Sometimes it's very hard and I have to match shed to head scale patterns - much more difficult. I don't track poops phew.

I do know a keeper that successfully keeps all his BRB's in one large naturalistic enclosure. Honestly I don't know how he keeps it clean etc.
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count (02/01/2010):
42.61 BRB
27.40 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

All valid points and really you've mentioned all of my concerns as well. I can easily understand how for a large scale breeding operation like the one you're running, this would be too time consuming for feeding/record keeping. On the other hand, for someone such as myself with 4.5 BRBs who loves an excuse to be working with my snakes I could see how this would work fine!!!

I dunno for sure, but I am seriously considering holding back 2 females from my next litter and raising them up together in one good sized enclosure and seeing how this works out! Will keep everyone informed!
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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

Thank for the first hand info, thats what I was looking for.

It seems like Ive heard someone on here say they keep their females together year round unless they're gravid. Was that you Jeff??

I just feel like if the snakes are 100% healthy and the keeper is anal (or close to it) about the care of their snakes it can be fine. I know they're active in the wee hours and all, but it just seems to me like the amount of space I give my adults (4x2x2 each) they could easily thrive with two females per cage.......

Oh yeah, and Im starting law school a The University of Missouri in August and living in a tiny apartment on campus for that! This is the real reason why I'm working on figuring out all of my spacing issues to the upteenth degree.... wanna be prepared!!!
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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

Congrats on law school! I'd love to know if housing them together works out for you. I've got limited space as well and I'd love to keep more than one BRB.
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~Cynthia

Yep I know exactly who you two are referring to! Paul has one of the neatest and most impressive BRB enclosures I have seen. I love to see people who have the guts to try something "out of the box" and be successful with it!

If we all, as a community of keepers, never try new things, we will always be stuck in the same old methods and never progressing our hobby as a whole. I feel like this is why our hobby has come such a long ways over the years and will continue to improve in the coming years!!!!
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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

This sounds interesting, who is this Paul? Does anyone have any photos of his set-up?

hey Trace,

Check out this link
http://forums.kingsnake.com/viewarch.php?id=1790669,1790669&key=2010

there are other threads with better pics of his setup etc but I couldn't locate them right now. Try searching in the archives for 2009 and later for them if you'd like. (i just searched his hisUSERname)

Very interesting setup and he takes immaculate care of them!! I love it!!!!
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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

I keep all of my non-breeding BRBs in separate enclosures, but all my breeding groups I keep together nearly year-round. I have found that this works best for me because I'm guaranteed not to miss that receptive window. I tried the re-introduction method and failed 2 years in a row.

It is a bit more work come feeding day, but it's worth it for me. I've never had a puke from keeping 3 full-bellied BRBs in the same cage, though I think it helps that they get a little time to get used to each others' presence before the first feeding.

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Aubrey Ross

©
www.SlipstreamSerpents.com

Interesting Aubrey!!!

So when you say you keep your breeding groups together nearly year round could you give me some type of monthly outline as to how often you keep them together per year??
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Ike Lightner

2.3 BRB Breeders(Dugo, Sultan, Roxxy, Brazita, & Lucille)
1.0 BRB striped holdback of my 8/23/10 litter of 25 (Nando)
1.1 100% het hypo BRB (Diego & Rasheena)
__________________________________________________________
0.2 BRBs still on hold. 1 hypo/1 het hypo (Ireena & Liddia)

Hmmm... I'm not really sure how to give you a monthly outline. Generally I put my breeding groups together in December or January and let them have about a week or two to get used to each other before offering food. I put them in separate feeding bins on feeding day.

I pretty much leave them that way until either babies arrive, or until the end of the year. They get about a month of being separate and then I put them back into breeding groups all over again.... unless I'm giving someone a year off. The exception would be if I see one is still gravid late in the year, such as Sable this past season.

BTW, have you been receiving my e-mails? I've sent a couple in the last month that I haven't received a response to.... just wondering if they are getting through.
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Aubrey Ross

©
www.SlipstreamSerpents.com

I agree with Dave. 1.2 during breeding season is fine...In fact 1.2 year round is also OK relative to the snakes, I have had good breeding success with this over the years. I often have both females together until the first one has babies, then I remove the babies and the skinny mother to individual cages. as long as there is not competition for the heat source, you should be alright.

Keeping multiple snakes per cage is not fine for me. Keeping multiple snakes in one cage is more than twice the work than 1 animal per cage times multiple cages. Seperating during feeding sucks, but having one snake try to constrict the other with massive teeth grabbing another snakes neck..... and trying to get the biter to let go without hurting the bitee, and without getting bit myself......NO FUN.

ALSO, I paid my way through GradSchool selling rainbowboas, (living in the same 10X15 foot room with 100 snakes for three years), so it can be done, and it is worth keeping your rainbowboas in whatever situation you have available. They have been successful at reproducing in extreme conditions for a million years, your unusual husbandry will not bother them in the slightest. Rainbowboas are nearly bulletproof.
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Bryan Hummel
www.rainbowboas.com