Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Used to breed / maintain the common westerns / mex, on fine gravel, with feeding separate inside a plain cardboard box. I'm getting back in because of all the beautiful morph's out there and wonder what the preferred sub-strata is for hatchlings to adults this time around?

Thanks,

Mike

I have been using paper towels for hatchlings and shredded aspen for older animals, but recently switched over to newspaper for the older ones, due to some problems with mouth damage and impaction. These problems seem to be pretty common with several people I've talked to. Newspaper isn't as attractive, or easy to clean as aspen, but that's a small price to pay if it keeps my animals safe.

Jon
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Ultimate Hognose

Yes, much safer. I use chlorine free towels at home (brown in color) so it should work out. They have a penchant for feeding in the "downward" position. Have you tried feeding in separate container with aspen in the living cage, or does the problem still
persist?

I have a fairly large collection, so feeding everything in separate containers would be a joke. I did it with a select few "special" animals before and it work well, but I decided a complete switch to paper was the best bet for me.

Jon
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Ultimate Hognose

What about Sandi-Chips? It seems like their small size would allow for easy passing if any were ingested.

However I have never seen these available and don't know how much they are, so maybe it isn't a feasible option.

Sani-Chips are available online. I think they are great, however, hognose can be messy eaters and ingest whatever the substrate is if particulate. So in that sense San-Chip vs aspen makes no difference.
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Mark

I'm glad you spoke up about that Jon. I've noticed that same thing and it's not a hygiene issue. I chocked it up to the fact that hognose are burrowers and are ALWAYS grinding their face into the tub. Although it does clear up rather quickly. Maybe the shavings play more of a roll in it than I thought...

Glad to hear you made the switch Jon!

~ Mike Russo

Thanks for the final nudge to get me to switch Mike.
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Ultimate Hognose

I agree with Jon. Paper is the best as I am going to switch all mine to newspaper as well. Not pretty, but no hazards.

David Turcotte

I've used rabbit pellets successfully for over 17 years for most of my colubrids, corn snakes, kingsnakes and hognose.
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Troy Rexroth
Rextiles

>>I've used rabbit pellets successfully for over 17 years for most of my colubrids, corn snakes, kingsnakes and hognose.

Do you still use the pellets? I'm not familiar with what rabbit pellets are. Is it a food for rabbits?
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Greg Bennett - Western Hognose Morphs
520.Hognose (520.464.6673) - www.hognose.com

Rabbit pellets are around a half inch hard little pellets that look just like there food. They may come in different colors but i think there green. That is actually a very good idea as i don't believe they would stick to the mouse when feeding. They are to big to sneak there way in also when feeding. It would be easy clean up and i do believe they absorb very well. This will allow them to burrow which we know they love doing. Hope this helps

Sorry for the late reply...

Yes, I still use rabbit pellets for all of my hognose and kings, snakes that don't need humidity.

The only problem with using rabbit pellets is that they will get moldy when in humid areas or get a lot of water dumped on them which isn't cleaned up right away. So if you live in a humid area, they probably aren't going to be a viable option.

Other than that, they clump like cat litter when defecated upon which makes cleanup very easy. Impaction from ingestion is of no concern due to rabbit pellets being a ground up alfalfa product, so it will easily break down and pass if ingested. It can be burrowed underneath unlike shavings which are actually being crawled beneath; snakes actually have to exercise more to dig and burrow in rabbit pellets. They are also cheap (if you buy them at a Feed store and not a pet store) and easily available at most places.

There are also caveats about using rabbit pellets, like mold that was already mentioned and a few other minor things but those would largely depend upon the individuals using them and what areas they live in. For me personally, I will always use rabbit pellets for my hognose and kings as a substrate as the pluses (for me) far outweigh the minuses.
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Troy Rexroth
Rextiles

I've always wondered why alfalfa pellets aren't used more, being that they are very inexpensive in bulk and are safe if ingested. When I asked around, I got two main answers, the most common being the mold thing.

If the cage is ventilated well and humidity is not high, then pellets are awesome.

The other answer was the weight issue for thin plastic racks.
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Mark

Good point and you are absolutely correct! Weight can be an issue depending on what types of racks/tubs you use. I use the typical sterilite tubs which are strong and durable enough to handle the weight of rabbit pellets and as I make my own racks out of wood, these can easily handle the added weight. But half a dozen tubs, even the shoebox sizes, can add up to a lot of weight if the rack of which they go in cannot handle the stress.

But yes, I too have often wondered why rabbit pellets are oftentimes unheard of as substrate when it can be a very viable and cheap substrate for many people. I first read about using them I believe in a reptile book or magazine 16-17 years ago and many of the pet/reptile stores that I used to frequent also used rabbit pellets for most of their "drier" reptiles.

Even after years of using rabbit pellets, I've tried sand, calci-sand, wood shavings, wood chips, folded newspaper, shredded newspaper and even "astro-turf" type carpeting. For my colubrids, I also ended up going back to rabbit pellets. The only exception is I use newspaper for my Balls for the obvious reason of mold issues in a more humid environment.
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Troy Rexroth
Rextiles

I use Sani-Chips for all sizes. I used to use paper towels for babies but now use only Sani-Chips.
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Greg Bennett - Western Hognose Morphs
520.Hognose (520.464.6673) - www.hognose.com

Greg,
I was wondering about that. Where do you get Sani-Chips? Thanks!

Ross

>>Greg,
>>I was wondering about that. Where do you get Sani-Chips? Thanks!

Ross,

I get it from a laboratory supply guy. He gives me a good deal for 10 bags.

I can help you out with getting some bags if you want. Send me an email or give me a call.
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Greg Bennett - Western Hognose Morphs
520.Hognose (520.464.6673) - www.hognose.com

Thanks Greg, I appreciate it! Will let ya know when I'm ready. Also, thanks for the video link.

Ross

I've used newspaper for bedding for my adult hogs for over two years now with no problems. I feed f/t and no matter what I tried I could not get the feeders to remain substrate free, so I made the switch. They hide under it and seem happy enough.

For hatchlings I use paper towels.
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