Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hello everybody!

I was just wondering... Pastel balls are fairly common and not very expensive (comparing with many other morphs). And they say that if you breed 2 pastels with eachother you will get 50% pastels 25% normals and 25% superpastels, technicly.. you could get 0% supers, and you could get 50% supers... Depends on the odds, right. BUT, what I don't understand is that if it's that easy to get supers.. how come they are so expensive? If i get 1.2 pastels, for the price of 1500$/snake, and get 6 eggs from each female. Then I should get about 4 super pastels.. How come they are priced over 10000$ if they are that easy to get? Must be something here that isn't right...
Or what do you say?

/Viktor

Hi there,

It's true that you could pick up a trio of baby pastels for $5,000. but, then you have 3-5 years before you get any supers (and they will be less expensive by then anyway, for the reasons you have cited).

If you want to make supers this year, you would pay $3,000 or so for a proven breeder male and maybe $4,000 each for two breeding sized girls (good luck finding them). Then, you still have to hit the odds right to get supers.

Also, right now, most people who have made supers are keeping at least a couple. After all, a male year-old super will produce all pastels so if he father's 15 babies his first year he's made more money than his selling price would have been had the breeder sold him. It pays to keep back at least a boy!

Most of us are still growing up female pastels to make our first supers with, so the demand is still high.

So there you have it. The prices are a function of time and availability.

Christy

I don't think you will see many Super Pastels readily available anytime soon. Most breeders are using their pastel females to cross into other projects. Anyone that produces female supers will hold onto them to do so as well. Breed a ghost to one and you get 100% pastel het for ghost. The pastel is by far the most important ingredient in putting the bright into all the new morphs. This is why they will hold their value for years to come.

MJ

How are you doing Christie? Hope all is well!
Markus Jayne Ball Pythons

If you think of Pastels as visual hets and Supers as the Morph then you will realize how hard Supers are to make and their true value. Pastel(het) x normal = 50% normals and 50% Pastels(hets). Pastel(het) x Pastel(het) 25% Super(morph), 50% Pastels(hets) and 25% normal - thats how you get f hets when you add up the 50%ers and 25%ers 2/3 of them are hets. Super(Morph) x Pastel(het) = 50% Supers(Morph) and 50% Pastels(hets). And Super(Morph) x Super(Morph) give you all Supers(Morph). This has not been done and made know to the public. Their has been hundreds of Pieds x Pieds and other moprhs, but no Supers x Supers. Supply and Demand at its finest.

Plus it's easier to make Pastel cross with another morph with Supers as previously stated.

All the percentage and odd stuff is not how things will always work out. My year was a prime example. 2 pastel to pastel breedings this year. The first clutch 5 eggs zero supers zero pastels 5 siblings. The second clutch 7 eggs 5 pastels zero supers 2 siblings. Thats zero supers out of 12 eggs. The odds don't have to work in your favor.

Now had I bred a super to the same two females I would have gotten 12 pastels minimum out of the same 12 eggs, not the 5 I ended up with. Do the math and now that super would have made me at least $7000 more than what I made with just a pastel. I now have no problem with the $15,000 price tag for supers, they are worth it.

If you think of Pastels as visual hets and Supers as the Morph then you will realize how hard Supers are to make and their true value. Pastel(het) x normal = 50% normals and P Pastels(hets). Pastel(het) x Pastel(het) % Super(morph) P
Pastels(hets) and 25% normal - thats how you get f hets when you add up the Pers %ers 2/3 of them are hets. Super(Morph) x Pastel(het) = P Supers(Morph) and P Pastels(hets). And Super(Morph) x Super(Morph) give you all Supers(Morph). This has not been done and made know to the public. Their has been hundreds of Pieds x Pieds and other moprhs, but no Supers x Supers. Supply and Demand at its finest.

Plus it's easier to make Pastel cross with another morph with Supers as previously stated.

1) As mentioned, supply and demand. If there are more people that want them than are out there, then the price stays put or actually rises. Simple economics. Pastels are relatively new and Balls have tiny clutches, so Supers aren't easy to come by.

2) What the snake is "worth" to tne breeder. If I have 29 adult females, and I bree even 1/3 of them to a Super, I can make 10 $6,000 clutches. That's insane. Its more worth it for me to keep a Super and make major cake of simple Pastels than it is to sell the Super for cheap.

I think reason #2 is way more important than reason #1. I always look at what the snake is worth to me, not other people. I have 12 ackie monitors. They are only "worth" $500 CDN as adult each. But I would never sell them for that. Each female lays 60 eggs each a year and those babies are $350-400CDN!! Its what its worth to the breeder/seller that's important.

But the market carries a LOT of weight as well.
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