Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I mean they look about the same and are about the same size arent they?
Im just wondering if its a personality thing or is it because Hondurans have more morphs? I guess Ive never seen an albino Sinaloan.But its hard to improve on the original.

I cant see alot of difference between the Sinaloans, Hondurans and Nelsons myself.

"I guess Ive never seen an albino Sinaloan"

Me neither, nor has anyone else for that matter, and I have been in the hobby for 45 years now...LOL! However, some folks will try to have people "believe" that their man-made albino Nelson's x Sinaloan crosses that they are selling are indeed albino "Sinaloans"......which is pure BS..

Anyway though, there are very distinct differences between the three subspecies, but it would take several feet of typing and countless photos for me to even begin to explain these differences in any detail along with the countless variations of Honduran milksnakes there are. Suffice it to say that you would notice more of a big difference in the Sinaloan's and Nelson's if hobbyists didn't cross them from the very beginning many years ago, but even that has a very lengthy explanation as well as to how this occurred..

The Honduran is very distinctly different looking than the Sinaloan or Nelson's, or even the commonly seen crosses of the nelsoni x Sinaloan that are all too common in the hobby. The most easily distinguished characteristic would be the wide snout band of the Honduran milksnake that the Sinaloans and Nelsons do not have. Their snouts are either solid black, flecked with some white, or in the case of some nelsoni, even a more solid light snout, but never banded as in the Hondurans.

The best thing you could possibly do for yourself is to get some inexpensive books on milksnakes, then along with what you read you could also compare some internet pics to get familiar with these differences.

cheers, ~Doug

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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

I think Doug would have done well to refer you to one of his older posts on the subject... sinaloan vs. nelson has been a popular topic. Doug's previous post comes with many great photos and can be read here:

http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1923940,1924292

Having just picked up a hondo myself I can tell you the biggest reason I prefer them is simply I like the heavy black scale tipping they are known for.

Every time Dniles posts pics of his sinaloans makes me realize I'll have some of them some day. His beauties can be seen here:

http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1940152,1940152

Wow, cant see a difference? Really? Well, there are many differences - Size, ease of breeding, morphs, ease of feeding neonates - the list goes on.

As far as Albino Sinaloans, I have several that have very low band-counts that are more Sinaloan than Nelson's in appearance - but this is a serious matter to some who believe that ALL are junk snakes now.

So, do some research, lurk on these boards...there are some very smart people here, and some very opinionated people here - no, not the same people.
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Scott MacLeod
2.6 Snow Hondurans
1.1 Aberrant Snow Hondurans
2.4 Aberrant Hondurans
1.3 Aberrant Tangerine Hondurans
1.2 Aberrant Hypo Hondurans
0.1 Aberrant Hybino Honduran
1.3 Extreme Hypo VP
1.1 Tricolor Hypo VP
1.3 Hypo E Sinaloan
1.0 Het Hypo E & Amel Sinaloan
0.1 Amel het Hypo E and Splotched
1.1 Albino Striped Sinaloan
2.7 Striped Splotched Sinaloan
1.2 Poss Het T pos Sinaloan
2.2 T pos Sinaloan

They are ALL beautiful in their own right for their own respective qualities......but jeez a handsome Sinaloan just can't be beat in my opinion.

One of my Cosala sinaloae . . .

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Jerry Kruse

UPDATED!
www.zonatas.com

And God said, "Let there be zonata subspecies for all to ponder..."

So now Im pretty sure that I may have a "junk" snake and not a true sinaloan.
That sucks.When I got it I was a little bummed that it didnt have perfect stripes and had those aberrant spots near the front too.I had seen some for sale from John cherry and I should have bought one of his as Im guessing those are pure.

Anyway what do you think, Its hard to get pics of such wiggly little critters.I couldnt get a good pic of her face but its got just a spot of white.

I wouldn't say your snake is junk, as has been pointed out lots of snakes out there labeled sinaloan have some degree of nelson influence and the opposite is also true. When you compare those snakes to those that are advertised as Cosala Sinaloans such as the one Mr. Kruse posted above sure you'll see the difference immediately... imperfect banding or spotting doesn't make the snake junk... check out the link below, it's a fairly good page with photos of each of the ssp's of milks along with morphs for some of them... not 100% accurate as some may point out but a pretty good page just the same to get a quick look for whats typical for each of the ssp's.

Bottom line here is perhaps you don't have the Rolls Royce of sinaloans but it's the snake you picked out because you liked it and it's what you wanted... enjoy it for those reasons. Plenty of time to get that Rolls if you get bitten by the "milk bug".

Gerry
Link

Whoah! I would not discount your gorgeous snake in any way! To me, it looks like a Sinalaon, very similar to a female breeder I had in the nineties. Not a junk snake at all!

That thing is awesome! The little abberancy is cool as well.
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Genesis 1:1

that's what i was thinking.

btw, 90's sinaloans and the more modern line bred cosala's don't have much in common looks-wise.

both are still sinaloans, just neither look alike.

Hi,I have many sinaloans and hondos (various morphs) every year and I can tell you that sinaloans are more popular in europe specially in my country "Slovakia".I think that most people like them because of their calm temperament compared to the hondos.I sold out all of my sinaloan babies this year while I still have many hondurans for sale.

Morphs = Popularity.

Look at the Western Hognose market, it's exploded in the last few years due to morphs.

Many reptile expos are dominated by Ball Pythons, because of all the morphs. Leopard Geckos and Crested Geckos are well-represented too...because they have so many morphs.

And Corn Snakes as well as Cal Kings are very popular for the same reason.

An adult Honduran is much bigger than a Sinaloan. They are virtually indestructable and live a long time (I have a 23 year old Honduran that I purchased as a yearling in 1989). As adults they are quite tame and handleable. And they love to eat. The orange and black look from the naturally occurring tangerine Honduran is unlike any snake I can think of. The tri-color look of Sinaloans can be found in just about every other of the twenty-something subspecies of milks out there.

I ain't got nothing against Sinaloans though.

Tim

Third Eye

here a striped one
enjoy
tjsreptiles