Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi,

I'm thinking of doing breeding loans with a friend. I'm the one with all of the females and my friend has the males. How do you split the clutches?

Is it 50/50?
Is it based on the values of the parents?

I'm just not sure what's fair especially when one of his males might be breeding multiple females of mines. Any info or advice would be appreciated.
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0.0.1 1983 boyfriend
1.0 2007 pug

The general rule with most animals that have multiple offspring is that the owner of the male gets first choice of one or the fare market value of said "pick of the litter". This would apply to each cluch sired.

This example is based off dog breeding but would also be valid for sakes.

In the end it is what ever the two of you work out.

Best of luck with your project. I wish you many pips.

A
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1.0 normal BP Nicodemus
1.0 BP Moufasa pos vanilla, fire, cinny
0.4 Cal Kings 3 alb 1 het Dora Queen Ace Pearl
2.0 Alb Corn Bizaar Elixir
0.0.1 Rev Alb Nelsons Oden

Rule of thumb is 50/50 unless you agree to something different!

It just doesn't seem to make sense to go 50/50 to me...

Here are my thoughts...
All of my females are morph females, 3-4 of them, his male is a double codom. It takes me way more time to raise the females to breeding size than it did for his male. In fact the females are of equal or more value (genetically speaking) to the male. Wouldn't that mean I would be better off buying my own breeder male?

I will be discussing this with my friend but just wanted to get a base idea of what's really fair.
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0.0.1 1983 boyfriend
1.0 2007 pug

Here are my thoughts...
All of my females are morph females, 3-4 of them, his male is a double codom. It takes me way more time to raise the females to breeding size than it did for his male. In fact the females are of equal or more value (genetically speaking) to the male. Wouldn't that mean I would be better off buying my own breeder male?

You answered your own question, yes you should own your own males, for so many reasons.

It can be anything you work out. You are right, it isn't fair to split 50/50, unless the males were special. If the males are VERY special, they might deserve more. All the things you mentioned are true. Talk it over with your friend, neither of you should be worried that your breeder loan isn't in my favor as much as so and so said I should get.

Buy you own breeder male....you will make your money back quick and wont loose a friendship over it...
Travis
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LAIR OF DRAGONS

Yeah...have to agree here. Depending on what the male is...you can pick one up easily.
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"What is man without the beasts?
If all the beasts were gone,
men would die from great loneliness of spirit.
For what happens to the beasts,
soon happens to men.
All things are connected."

-Chief Seattle (Duwamish Tribe)

www.youtube.com/reptilenexus

I have done some where we swap males and we get what we get from our own females. Another one is my het male to his albino female. We are splitting 50/50 but she is staying with me till she lays and I am incubating the clutch as well.

Personally, and this is just my opinion...

If they are my females, and I am incubating the eggs, I think it's fair I get first pick from a clutch, then they get second, I get third etc etc.

Same goes for if it is their female. They get first pick, I get second.

The females are really the ones at risk when it comes to breeding and egg laying.
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"What is man without the beasts?
If all the beasts were gone,
men would die from great loneliness of spirit.
For what happens to the beasts,
soon happens to men.
All things are connected."

-Chief Seattle (Duwamish Tribe)

www.youtube.com/reptilenexus

males are cheap enough....

loans don't work

friends become---- not-friends

buy a male ,or five...whatever you like ,and or need.....

cheap enough......

really....

(it wouldn't be 50 -50 if you got the girls....)
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........JY

Very much ares with what JYohe posted...

sorry but I have to ask, 0.0.1 1983 boyfriend. how does one get an unsexed mate besides the obvious?
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1.0 firefly(pos het pied) 1.0 enchi 0.1 bumblebee 0.1 mojave 0.1 butter pastel 0.1 spotnose 0.1 pewter 0.1 pastel 0.1 pied 0.1 het pied 0.1 vanilla 0.7 normals

... when they pop funny and you can't find a probe big enough...

;p
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0.0.1 1983 boyfriend
1.0 2007 pug

I don't like to probe...I can and have for 20 years plus...
I pop...but adults usually won't let you pop them...

want to sex a BIG ball?...throw it in with males....it will either fight or get chased....simple..usually....

again...at times nothing happens...I hate that....keep trying....

....
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........JY

Who will hold the mating pairs, watch for copulations and sheds?
Who will incubate eggs? All of this is extra work for the person doing it.

I took my friend's two female normals and paired with my Spider and Pied males. The Spider was successful (not the Pied pairing) and I got pick of one Spider. I was doing it for my friend to get him some morphs and I was happy with the arrangement. Whatever works for you!
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Susan Sentman
SSNAKES Reptiles
susan@ssnakes.com

I guess your method of sexing adults would work too, just throw a little alcohol in the mix. The males will fight, the m/f combos will, well, we know what they will do.

A couple of breeding seasons ago I discovered two mis-sexed males when they combated with the same mojave male I put into breed each. Looking back I should have been suspicious of their male like eating habits and builds but one of them was sexed female by a very experienced breeder.
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Randy Remington
anyone@snakemorphs.com
www.SnakeMorphs.com
FaceBook

I think both of you missed this part.

sorry but I have to ask, 0.0.1 1983 boyfriend. how does one get an unsexed mate besides the obvious?

Probably the same way you get an unsexed snake, not obvious enough for me.

I took a "son" of the male that was mis-sexed female by an experienced breeder to a show this year. Eventually had like 8 experienced breeders try to sex it and the split came out near 50/50. Dad's been a good breeder in spite of spending years effectively in the "other" category. I'll have to check up on the son in a year or two to see how he turns out.
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Randy Remington
anyone@snakemorphs.com
www.SnakeMorphs.com
FaceBook

lol. randy the original poster in her sig states 0.0.1 boyfriend. that is where the question came how she has an unsexed boyfriend.
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Josh & Krysty Hutto

Various Ball Pythons, boas, dogs, cats, fish, a couple sulcatas and a few other odds and ends.

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

Probably the same way you get an unsexed snake, not obvious enough for me.
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Randy Remington
anyone@snakemorphs.com
www.SnakeMorphs.com
FaceBook

haha!
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0.0.1 1983 boyfriend
1.0 2007 pug

maybe she knows more than he does already?...

who knows...lots of guys switch hands mid life.....?

.........play ball.....!!!!!
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........JY

whats fair is what you both agree upon....on paper and signed with a notary public present.

right now i have an adult female mojave on another coast with my friend Alan Cole. we have an agreement between emails with no notary public, but its an extreme distance problem. we have all are details worked out prior to any shipping of any animals.
it must be agreed upon by both parties or its a no go. simple as that. the real problem arises when your going for a valuable animal and you only produce 1, when both parties are expecting one or more each. sometimes you will have a disappointing clutch. at which point someone may end up with the short end of teh stick.
its always best to have your own males. if your friend has a really valuable male then it may be worth pursuing. but if your using his pastel male to your bumble bee then its best to just shell out 50 bucks on an adult pastel male.
adam jeffery
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" a.k.a. farfrumugen "
When I die, I want to go peacefully like my Grandfather did, in his sleep -- not screaming, like the passengers in his car.

My story : I currently have a loan breeding with a friend.

My female is at it's place, cause he is also breeding his male to other female.

We agreed that he will have first pick and I will have second etc...

The male is about the same value as the female in $ term.
Even if it's easier to find a male of this morph than a female.

I am doing it cause I didn't have much male free for her (all have already enough mate), even if it's one of my pride girl.
I hope we get more than only one, if we don't it's still OK and we can always agree on something.

He is taking care of her and also incubating the eggs (if any, cause you never know).
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Answer and proposition :

Lastly, since you have quite a few females in the mix, it's change a lot the deal.

All the females together are worth more than the single male and that's make a huge difference.

You should at least have the first pick.

You could agree on a general term, meaning first pick overall the clutch. Or a by clutch term.

It could be you : 1st, Him : second and third, etc...

btw : isn't a bit late to do loan ? Females are ready to ovulate or have already ovulated, I think you are both a little late, but you never know.
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love this world, don't hate it.

Thanks for the info, that helps a lot.

It's not too late in the season, I breed around this time every year. The eggs come around summer. Seems to be the cycle for my area.
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0.0.1 1983 boyfriend
1.0 2007 pug