Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well, a few of us were discussing the Mega Hypo stuff, spawned after Doug and Ross did that great blog on the "Hobby Hondo".

I stated that I had one of the only Mega females in existence. Don Shore reminded me that he had TWO Mega hypo females (very uncommon) but one had died a year or so ago.

To be even more correct, Don Shores had 3 Mega hypo females at one point. (However, only the Mega Anery is left.)

The matriarch of the entire line, Mega Triple Het (Deceased) shown with the original “Mystery Male” (owned by Shannon Brown)

Head shot of the Mega Triple Het (sold to me from Don Shores):

Some of her offspring, Summer of 2007 (owned/produced by Terry M.):

A sibling female to the original "Mystery Male" Owned by Don Shores (Deceased)

Can you say FREAKIN DIFFERENT!!!!

A Mega Ghost or Mega Anery with a Mega Hypo sibling (looked like an Anery as a neonate), produced by Terry M. in Aug 2007 (Owned by Don Shores)

Then:

Now, with the same male sibling:

The REALLY interesting link between these unique 3 females is ALL of them exhibit the same blotchy hypo (missing pigment) effect. However, NONE of them showed this appearance as neonates and ALL of them were labeled as phenotypically "normals" (non hypo)!

Here are close up pics of the missing pigment, so you can see what I’m referring to:

The matriarch of the entire line, Mega Triple Het

Another of the matriarch, overexposed pic to show the difference:

Here are two pics of Don Shore's Mega Anery (or Mega Ghost):

Totally the same look!!!

Here’s a typical Hypo Hobby Hondo for comparison purposes:

Here is the Hypo above as a neonate:

Most of you all know that Hypomelanistic Hobby Hondos look the BEST as neonates and darken with age, some almost look normal as adults. The Mega animals however, have the opposite occur.

This female Mega of mine is unique in that she was definitely produced from breeding Mega to Mega (line bred). It will be VERY interesting to see what her “dark” pigment looks like in a couple years.

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I've been primarily focusing on outcrossing the Mega gene(s), because not many people have had success in breeding them, to try and strengthen this unique line.

Side Note: Keep in mind, to use a Mega X ANY Unknown (Hypo, Anery, Ghost, Hybino, Amel, Snow, Pearl, etc.) to get a phenotype of a true Mega, the other animal would either have to carry the Mega gene (dominate or recessive or polygenetic) or the Mega gene would have to be some sort of Co-dominant form of Hypo.

One of the VERY FEW folks to have any breeding success is a buddy of mine Rodney J.
He acquired one of the clutch mates to my Mega Line Tricolor Hypo (known as the mystery clutch that Terry M. produced).

Unfortunately, this is another one of the many Mega Line animals that is now deceased.

However, before he died, Rodney did breed it to this Snow het Hypo:

Here are two OUTSTANDING Tricolor Mega Line Hypo males from that pair (both now owned by Don Shores):

Rodney initially sold one male, from the above pic, to Don Shores and kept back the “lighter yellow” Tricolor Mega Line Hypo:

Here’s the “lighter yellow” tricolor as an adult:

Then Rodney bred the “lighter yellow” tricolor Mega Line Hypo back to a few different females (a couple Hypos and a Ghost) in 2011. Here’s him in action with a Hypo:

Here he is again with a very nice female extreme:

Unfortunately, I don’t have any pics of the offspring, but Rodney was overall disappointed with the results and sold (I believe) all the Hondos to Don Shores.

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Another fantastic Mega Line Hypo was produced by Jeff Alloway and Shannon Brown purchased it:

Another pic of him a little older:

Unfortunately, this male is also deceased.

Many of these Mega line or Mega Hypos (accurate terminology TBD on what is Mega or not) died as a result of classical brumation (a temperature cool down without light).

Personally, I do not cool any of my Hondos, I only reduce the light cycle, and I have had great success with breeding (so has Rodney, Doug Mong and I believe Don). I would NOT recommend cooling any Central America Milks, because I feel it is risky and unnecessary for successful breeding. (Just my opinion).

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Here are some of my favorite outcrossed offspring over the past two years that I’ve produced (yes all directly from my Tricolor Mega Line Hypo Het Snow):

You recognize any of these Cole?

I’ll end with this, I just love the variety!!!

-Rusty
Neonate pics of my Tricolor Mega Line Hypo Het Snow

I DO NOT know everything about this "Mega" stuff yet.

There could be many factors at work, however, it IS 100% something different.

I will get to the bottom of it hopefully before I die!!!

I just wanted to share the information with you folks, because I think it's very interesting.

Oh, and if anyone has ANY of the offspring from Terry M.'s clutch, please let me know!!!!!

Thanks,
Rusty

I do own a sister mega to the mystery male still.

After speaking with Don and obviously confusion on my part, it turns out Don has another female from the Mega Line.

Here she is with another Mega Line Hypo (or Mega Hypo):

Don will have to comment on the background of this female.

Did she look like a "normal" as a neonate?

Thanks,
Rusty

The female in this post is a female Jeff Alaway hatched out of the same clutch as the mystery male. I'm not sure if it's a mega normal or a mega hypo.

That doesn't really look like normal black pigment to me in the photo. I would guess it is probably just a darker hypo than the others typically are. It sure does seem to look very gray in quite a bit of the animal's rings and suffusion.

Very cool snake Don!..

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

"some are just born to troll and roll"

This post is outstanding! Thanks for putting it together. This one is incredible! A mega hypo with black pigment. Unreal. How is that explained? Did the black pigment slowly come in after it was born?

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No, actually the complete opposite!

From my post:

The REALLY interesting link between these unique 3 females is ALL of them exhibit the same blotchy hypo (missing pigment) effect. However, NONE of them showed this appearance as neonates and ALL of them were labeled as phenotypically "normals" (non hypo)!

Most of you all know that Hypomelanistic Hobby Hondos look the BEST as neonates and darken with age, some almost look normal as adults. The Mega animals however, have the opposite occur.

So, the missing pigment does not present until some time later in their life.

Cool huh!?

Thanks for the kind words Ross!

-Rusty

Wow, that's very interesting. Thanks, Rusty.
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I agree with Ross. The work was really nicely done.

Hopefully you'll produce some Mega line stuff this year, you are overdue.

-Rusty

Thanks Rusty for the "Mega" Honduran treat. Fascinating, to say the least. It's very interesting how many of those beautiful animals do not exist anymore because of brumation.

Continue to enjoy that project! Looking forward to this years offspring.

--Dennis

Thanks Dennis...I sure have high hopes with this line!

-Rusty

Thanks Rusty! I guess I need to rack my brain around some more Hondo genetics. Thanks for the history lesson on this line it is always good to know. I will save this right next to Doug and Ross's hondo blog. Good Job!
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Glad you enjoyed it sir!

-R

Wow Rusty!,.......you really smashed one out of the park with this detailed post my friend!..

This post was nothing short of outstanding in my opinion, and quite obviously took quite a bit of time to gather and put together. Kudos on the great work dude. many of the details you pointed out were very interesting indeed.

Thanks for sharing all of this from the different sources with everyone!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

"some are just born to troll and roll"

Yeah, took me DAYS to put this together, just uploading and finding all the pictures took huge amounts of time.

I know MANY things are up in the air with this line, but after seeing some obvious links, I felt it was time to do a post.

You and Ross also motivated me as well with your post and all that great information.

Thanks Bud!

You have studied and researched this line exhaustively.If anyone deserves to unravel the "mystery" of the Mega line it is you. Thanks again for your dedication,accuracy and persistance.Completely impressive post!
Rodney

You've been instrumental in helping unravel this mystery too Rodney.

You let me know when you get that Hondo itch again, you know I'll send a package of fun your way!

Glad you enjoy the post!

-Rusty

That was a mega-cool post! I've not seen some of those pics (especially the "freakin' different" snake). It gives a hint of the possibilities to come with selective breeding.

Thanks Rusty!

Tim

Glad you like it Tim.

If it wasn't for all these interesting and unknown genetics, I'd wouldn't be so interested.

-Rusty

I really enjoyed that Rusty and learned more about the history and the current state of the Mega project! Sorry to hear some of those killer Megas have not made it but glad you're working to keep it going. That is a really cool project.

Dave
DNS Reptiles - Milk Snakes

Thanks Dave, it's been a very LONG term project for me.

I knew I wanted to get some of these animals when I saw the first one, the "Mystery Hypo" at Jeff Alloway's place many years ago.

Unfortunately, I didn't have THAT kind of money to get into the project at that time.

I've been following the line ever since.

-Rusty

Great animals. Wanted to commend you for that blip about brumating Central American milks, especially the more lowland species. Talk about treating all snakes the exact same, I see that all the time where keepers put all of their colubrids at 50 deg for 2-3 months when some of those are clearly from areas that do not see low temps for any length of time. I did that too before. Good reminder for us keepers to not treat every ssp of snake the same.

There is nothing that is absolute!

I know many people that brumate (classically) and have no issues at all...so it can be done either way...I just prefer not to, for many reasons.

Thanks,
Rusty

I agree whole-heartedly with you guys on this too. As we have both discussed personally several times before in the past.....Since when do the lowlands of tropical Central America ever get into the 50's or lower 60's?, and especially for several months on end??..LOL!......just doesn't happen. If it did, the rest of the northern hemisphere is already in deep "doo-doo" with another catostrophic Ice Age..

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

serpentinespecialties.webs.com

"some are just born to troll and roll"