Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hello, i tried several genetics calculators and the punnett squares throw me for a loop when it comes to snakes carrying 2 genes, so....

numerically speaking, what would be the possible outcome for....

caramel het ghost x caramel het ghost

and

caramel het ghost x ghost het caramel

looking for a new project and trying to decide which way to go. thanks...

jonathan

Caramel het ghost x caramel het ghost =
All of them will be caramels, that is for sure.
25% caramels
50% caramel het ghost
25% caramel ghost
That is chance per egg.

Caramel ghost x ghost het caramel=
25% double het ghost and caramel
25% Ghost het caramel
25% caramel het ghost
25% Ghost caramels.

Hope that helps
-----
"What is man without the beasts?
If all the beasts were gone,
men would die from great loneliness of spirit.
For what happens to the beasts,
soon happens to men.
All things are connected."

-Chief Seattle (Duwamish Tribe)

www.youtube.com/reptilenexus

fairly the same outcome....but I don't think you want to breed caramel to caramel....

so...get the best male you can...like a ghost caramel male...or at least a caramel het ghost male....then get female ghosts het caramel for him to breed...along with maybe pastel ghost het caramel ,pstels het carmale and ghost....try and get 100 % guarenteed hets....possible hets would make it less valuable and alot less fun if they don't prove out....

I had a bunch of these exact animals....before I sold them all ....it is one project I miss thinking about....
pastel carmael glows and glows....mmmmmmmmm racks full of them....

...go for it....buy smart....
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........JY

1.1 humans
squirrels and rabbits in the back yard
and some spiders on the celler walls
0.0 herpetefauna

chief, exactly what i was looking for. thanks! do you do the punnett squares or is there a calculator for double genes?

jy, you gave me some good nuggets of knowledge to chew on. thanks! i do have several questions for you. i'm still fairly new with bp's. first, why would you not recommend caramel to caramel? more likely to have kinks? i heard the glows don't have that as much. mind if i ask why you are no longer into keeping bp's? seems like you really enjoyed it.

i'm a little nervous about hets now. i just talked to one big bin breeder just a couple days ago who said "my partner and i don't sell anything as possible hets. we sell everything as 100% if there is a possibility." there are some shady cock-a-roaches out there. anyway...

thanks for the info...

jonathan

You can do both

caramel het ghost x caramel het ghost
each has two different gene combinations it can pass, give a caramel and a ghost/hypo gene (CG) or just a caramel (Cg)

CG Cg
CG CCGG CCGg
Cg CCGg CCgg

so you can see they are always caramel, 25% chance of having ghost/hypo (CCGG), 50% chance of being het (CCGg), and 25% chance of just being a caramel (CCgg). Obviously in reality all non-ghost/hypo would be 66% possible het.

caramel het ghost x ghost het caramel

CG Cg
CG CCGG CCGg
cG CcGG CcGg

Doing this you avoid possible hets, since you know what all of them are, 25% glow (CCGG), 25% Caramel het ghost (CCGg), 25% Ghost het caramel (CcGG), 25% double het (CcGg)

or you can just use a calculator... http://www.owalreptiles.com/genetics.php#8.5,16&8.5,16
http://www.owalreptiles.com/genetics.php#8.5,16&8,16.5

He does not recommend caramel females because they have fertility issues, high number of slugs.

I really hope you misunderstood the breeder, that's just wrong... there are plenty of breeders with great reputations from years of doing honest business, buy from them.

Well guess the forums trim out spaces, ill try these tables again

caramel het x caramel het

.........CG........Cg
CG..CCGG..CCGg
Cg...CCGg...CCgg

caramel het x ghost het

.........CG........Cg
CG..CCGG..CCGg
cG...CcGG...CcGg

Yes, maybe the breeder said they don't bother selling possible hets, only 100% hets. Meaning they sell the possibles as normals and only bother to mention the gene when it's 100%. That's common practice now days where possible hets are not very valued and tend to confuse people. I still mention the possibles when selling but swear some times they would sell better if I didn't.
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Randy Remington
anyone@snakemorphs.com
www.SnakeMorphs.com
FaceBook

I just wrote them out by hand. I prefer to do that. Keeps my brain sharp.
-----
"What is man without the beasts?
If all the beasts were gone,
men would die from great loneliness of spirit.
For what happens to the beasts,
soon happens to men.
All things are connected."

-Chief Seattle (Duwamish Tribe)

www.youtube.com/reptilenexus

buy smart....I never been screwed over on hets ,,,and I bought from people who got them on second hand trades even....hets...cheap way to cool...

I sold...tired...old...and hate my neighbors....miss the snakes...

punnet squares...No...I just think in my head....I aced Biology II in High School and I had it a year earlier than 90% of the rest of my class...(yea...I can be smart if I like it)...anyways...easier to just do the thinking in your head....you'll get it....

....start with the double gene like snow...amel x anery /axanthic.....1 in 16 chance of snaw 1 of normal...you get like 3 amel and 3 anery in 16...and the rest hets...but balls don't give 16 eggs like corns...so...you just breed and pray...and then either yell and whine for another year...or gt really happy when your snake buddies visit.....(showoff)...LOL

...good luck...buy less snakes with double or triple genes...makes more colors...more cash and less space and work...

NOW is the time to buy....cheap cheap cheap snakes out there...just look first....

like when people sell out....
-----
........JY

1.1 humans
squirrels and rabbits in the back yard
and some spiders on the celler walls
0.0 herpetefauna

jy, good advice. thanks! funny you mentioned snow for an example because that is one of my projects. i have a visual of each that are het for the other. i have yet to sit and read an article on the punnett squares/genetics. that is on my must read list.

i look for the right deal and when i find it, i snatch it up. it stops me dead in my tracks whenever i see a "great feeder" that is almost a yr old and less than 200g. grr... one of my pet peeves.... got burned trying one like that about 10 yrs ago. won't happen again. i search ads eveyday looking for a new project though.

randy, good point! maybe i misunderstood him. i hadn't thought about it that way. i will give him the benefit of the doubt. i personally don't have a problem with possibles. i will only buy visual or positive hets. if that happen to have a possible in there as well, then so be it.

jonathan

"i personally don't have a problem with possibles. i will only buy visual or positive hets. if that happen to have a possible in there as well, then so be it."

I think a lot of keepers have made the decision not to mess with possible hets and as soon as you start mentioning them even the ones that understand it start putting up walls (maybe they think I'm trying to charge more for the possible hets?). I don't fully understand it as I would always like an extra chance for free. Maybe you wouldn’t have done it but I swear there are some that if I told them their visual was also possible het for something else they would have ended up buying another one that wasn't mentioned as a possible het (even if a lot of visuals are possible het for something else now days).
-----
Randy Remington
anyone@snakemorphs.com
www.SnakeMorphs.com
FaceBook

poss hets should get us more cash...it used to...in alot of things it still does....(poss het toffee? still sells)...why not ghost....

mention ...I got this super pastel other morph...poss het ghost....or anything poss het ghost...and the buyer says.." yea...but it don't count" or "yea...but it doesn't matter"...like ghost won't add a whole new color to the project....I hated that...happened too often the last few years.....almost all my stuff had ghost in it somewhere....

....and as Randy said...people just don't mention it....if you have alot of babies...we sell the het females and visuals...I used to take the het males and poss hets to the pet shop....that way they just got sold as normals...to people who more than likely will kill the snakes from stupidity within a year or two...or get rid of it some other way....(((yea, I know...people don't get the "they live 50 years" part....)))

..
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........JY

1.1 humans
squirrels and rabbits in the back yard
and some spiders on the celler walls
0.0 herpetefauna

Why did you sell your snakes?