Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I've been raising a pair of eastern black kings from KY since summer. They've eaten pinkies like champs and doubled in size, but since the beginning of November, they've refused live and f/t pinkies. Is this natural? I don't have any extra heat on them, figuring they are a North American colubrid and shouldn't require any. I'd like to keep them growing. Does anyone have experience raising hatchlings?

>>I've been raising a pair of eastern black kings from KY since summer. They've eaten pinkies like champs and doubled in size, but since the beginning of November, they've refused live and f/t pinkies. Is this natural? I don't have any extra heat on them, figuring they are a North American colubrid and shouldn't require any. I'd like to keep them growing. Does anyone have experience raising hatchlings?
>>

It's that time of year for some areas...If they shut down then shut them down for the winter. They will come out of brumation feeding like champs in February or March.
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John Lassiter
Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...

Can't help you much, just wanted to share. I acquired a WC hatchling late this past summer, here in Alabama. He eats great. I gave him a bigger live pinky, that I would have put money on, that he would not be able to eat it. He ate it any way. Incredible apatite. I don't have extra heat on any of my snakes either, due to the fact that my wife like the house around 75 deg. I will let you know if he keeps eating through the winter.
DAVY

Gorgeous. I'd love to see how his color fades.

thank you
Yea I hope he keeps most of his color.
I will post pictures from time to time as he grows.
DAVY

Of course its normal if the temps drop below what can sustain their feeding and digesting food, they will stop feeding. They are reptiles.

If you want them to feed, add heat. If not wait until it gets warmer.

None of that has to do with whats natural. As keeping them in a box is not natural. Not judging, its what we do. But still, that box has nothing to do with nature, nor does the temps in your house.

What is natural depends on where they would have been hatched. Some areas have heat to support neonates year around, others don't. Some years can support year around activity, other years don't. That is natural.

Part of being natural is the snakes learning to find areas that have more heat then others, then using those areas to extend the active period as long as they can.

Two days ago, I found a neonate hognose that had a large food bolus(lizard) It was aprox 45F where it was, the night time temps were right at 32F, and it was moving to heat so it could digest its bolus. A few days before that, I observed a medium sized coachwhip with a huge and I mean huge food bolus. It was doing the same as the hog, seeking heat.

I friend of mine that lives on Staten Island, NY. when made aware that snakes can be active year around, started looking in the winter and sees several species out and basking year around.

Again, you have control over captives, so you can support them anyway you want. I am just not sure nature has much to do with it. Being a reptile does, if they cannot find heat, they shut down. Best wishes Cheers

If snakes find food, they eat. If they don't, they don't.

If snakes find heat, they get warm. If they don't, they don't.

If snakes find water, they drink. If they don't, they don't.

Got it? Pretty simple right.

I really have a hard time with people, as you know. And I do because of such approaches to thinking. I simply cannot understand why you think so little of snakes.

It sounds like you think these animals have no behavior and are mindless. Which is so far from the reality.

No, its not if they cannot find food, they do not feed. Their task in life is to learn to locate food over the longest period possible. They use all their tools to find food, they move, they use sight, they use smell, and they use memory. And they use instinct. All together, they use behavior. They move from place to place in order to find food and temps and moisture.

Why did the chicken cross the road, food and water was on the other side. Or a cockle. Same reason snakes cross the road.

They go and find temps, and go and find prey sources, then they remember exactly where and when. They follow scent trails, theirs and others of their own kind to find these resources. Maybe even scent trails of other kinds of snakes to find their prey.

If they do not find them, they DIE. Then when the weather becomes unsupportive, they find areas they can still live in.(hiberniculums etc)

They find these to be utilized at different times of the year. And take Advantage of them when they are needed.

How well they do in nature is directly related to their ability to make these decisions and learn.

They move from one prey source to another. Take the hognose, so far, they work nests in the late spring(theory), then toads when the rains hit(not theory), then move to lizards(not theory), which they are still working and its Dec. And they do so by moving from one area to another.

In your cage, its like you said, and its that way, because there is NO OTHER CHOICE. I recomend opening the cage door and see what happens. Or just offering choices and SEE what happens.

But then, I think your just trying to start an arguement, as you really can't be that simple. Can you? Cheers

"But then, I think your just trying to start an arguement, as you really can't be that simple. Can you?"

OH ! OH! , I KNOW THE ANSWER!!!

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Has the ambient temperature changed from summer until now? That and light cyles can cause snakes to go off feed in the fall.

Tim

I am sorry you did not get the help you came here looking for. Some had no relevance what-so-ever to your question.

Like i said I probable can't help you but considering the answers you got so far, I will attempt to give you my inexperienced and uneducated hypothesis.

The answer to your question is, YES it is natural for them to quit eating this time of year in the wild and in captivity.
If you want to feed them during the winter, keep the ambient temp in the low 70's and then give them extra heat on one side of there enclosure, with a moist hide on the cool side.
There is no guarantee that they will eat, but KEEP TRYING. There are tricks you can try, and I am sure I don't know half of them, but try scenting a pinky with an anole lizards saliva. Let it bite the pinkies head. That one worked for me.
Tim made a good point also.
DAVY

Lol, I appreciate the comments, all of them. We also have some young box turtles that naturally stop feeding and go into "hibernation" this time of year, so it would seem natural if these did too. All of my other colubrids, FL kings and corns, eat right through winter, but I'm sure they do in the wild too in the far south. A pair of ball pythons with a heat lamp do, also. I live in the Blue Ridge Mtns in an old farmhouse that we don't even try to keep above 70 in the Fall thru Spring. I just moved them into slightly larger containers. They have good body weight, so I think I'll not be too concerned, let them do their thing, and offer pinkies every once in awhile to see if they're interested.