Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have been experiencing some mixed feelings lately about my first tortoise, Spartacus. I’ve had Sparty (a Greek tortoise) for a year and a half. I purchased him as a hatchling. The first year, I kept him inside only and felt pretty confident that he was getting what he needed in terms of heating, light, vitamins, food, environment. Over the summer, I hired someone to build him an outdoor enclosure. I had hoped from the beginning that as he grew he would be able to live almost full time outdoors.

The problem is that I am constantly worrying about the temperatures outside. I live in Phoenix, AZ. For a lot of the summer, I brought him inside on days that were over 103 degrees or so. Now, it has finally cooled down, and I am worried that it’s too cool! It’s only like 85 today, so I think to myself, “How can this be warm enough when indoors his basking area is around 95?” Am I worrying too much?

His enclosure doesn’t get a lot of direct sunlight, so I am concerned that he can’t really bask. When the enclosure was built the sun’s direction must have been different because I thought it would be the perfect spot, half sun and half shade. Now it seems to be all shade. That was fine when it was 100, but now...

I need a little support or advice. I’m starting to wonder if I am really cut out for reptile ownership. I’m so worried all the time!

I have 2 dogs, 4 cats, 7 rats, and 2 frogs that are happy and healthy, so it’s not like I am a novice pet owner. This is just so different.

Am I in over my head or did everyone have these same doubts starting out?

Thanks.
Kate

Kate,

It's easy to over-stress about the enclosure we provide for our animals.

It sounds like your greek is rather young still. I'd keep him/her indoors for another season or two and undertake an important bit of research.

Find the right place in the yard for an outdoor habitat. You will need to measure how much sunshine hits the enclosure during each month that the tortoise will spend in the habitat. During this time, measure the temps and record them. This will give you a better understanding of what area in the yard is right.

I live in San Francisco where temps are not optimal either. In the summer, I can have temps dive to 49 at night. I studied my yard for one season and made some adjustments. I installed a Kane heat mat and a ceramic heater that kick on at night to raise the temps to 70.

You want an enclosure that is not engulfed in direct sunlight, especially in your region or the summer days will be too hot. You will likely want a hide that allows the tort to escape the high temps. 85 doesn't sound low to me. Even though 90 is the temp indoors, many torts don't like temps that warm and will seek shelter. The mid-high 80s is perfect for basking.

Bottom line... Do the research and your tortoise will be happier, but best of all, you won't worry.

Paul

Paul,
Thanks for the thoughtful advice. Out of curiosity, how do you get electricity to your heat sources in the outdoor habitat? I guess I'll bring Sparty back inside for now, and just put him out in the afternoons that are warm and sunny.

By the way, I do have a hide box for Sparty, but I'm amazed by how far down in the dirt he burrows. If I want to bring him in at night, I have to dig down like 4 inches to find him! I don't even think the hide box helps as much in temperature regulation as his digging does. He is also camoflauged so well in the soil, it's neat!

Thanks again.
Kate

I don't know how many tortoises/animals I've seen killed with kindness.
This is why I recommend starting simple.
An enclosure, substrate, a heat source, water and food (in that order of priority)
Then, when the little guy is settled in you can start messing with structures and the like.
This formula will work indoors or out.
If the little guy is out and about at least in the morning and afternoon you have the formula down.
The important things are, again, heat (75 - 100 F for most tortoises) and hydration. If you've got this down you have plenty of time to get the rest right.
Again, if you keep it simple there is less to worry about.
Ed

Part of the problem is that I work all day during the week, but I can tell when I get home that he has eaten ALL of his food. I assume that means he was warm enough.

I don't know how to get an electric heat source to his outdoor enclosure. So, what low nighttime temp says it's time to bring him inside?

Boy, am I glad I got a relatively small tortoise, because it sounds like he is going to be living part of the year inside indefinitely. So much for the pet store telling me that the breeders have their Greek tortoises living outdoors year-round! : S

Thanks!
Kate

once it reaches adult and you live in a temperate zone climate you probably can keep it outdoors provided it is a European type graeca.
Otherwise it will do just fine indoors.
Ed

The pet store advice may not be far off... Testudo Graeca comes from regions that are similar in climate to where you live, perhaps a little cooler.

Check out this link for information regarding the species...

This tortoise hibernates in it's native region so it's not uncommon for people to have them housed outdoors all year. They are not known to do well when housed indoors for too long, as with most tortoise.

Your winters are pretty mild and the tort, if provided with the right habitat go through a good dormant cycle.

Read up on the species. It's best that you take the initiative to learn as much as possible to provide the best care for this particular animal.

Paul
Tortoise Trust - Greek Tortoise

Very big 'depends' here.
If it is from the northern part of their range or is a Mountain race you can hibernate if that is your desire. If it is a desert or southern range greaca, you will most likely kill it if you desire to hibernate it.
If it is CB it is most likely an Ibera type greek and you can hibernate it. If it is a WC it is most likely a warm climate greaca and it is not a good idea to cool it down.
Ed
(not to add to your worries or anything)

He was born in captivity, that much I know for sure. He was so tiny when I got him. : )

I've looked at pictures of the different subspecies to try to figure out what kind Spartacus is, but I am still confused. He is very dark, olive colored with lots of black. For this reason, I would guess he is from a mountain area, not the desert. He just wouldn't blend in the desert. I've seen pictures of much lighter, sand colored Greeks. Sparty is not one of them!

He is a handsome devil though!

Thanks again.
Kate

You most likely have a Testudo graeca ibera or Testudo ibera... depending on whos taxonomy you follow.
Regardless, the species does hibernate in its native range but once again, it does not have to hibernate to survive if you have it under the proper conditions. As a rule, these a very tough little guys.
Ed

Post a picture and perhaps collectively we can id the little booger and go from there.

Point being, learn as much as you can about the specific animal you keep.

Paul

Katie, you are worrying too much. It really isn't that difficult, as much as it seems like it is. Tere is no reason your Greek can't stay outside all year, provided you give him an adequate enclosure. The main concern is his small size. There may be predators in your area that can kill and eat him. This of course can be avoided if you put screening over the top of the enclosure. The best place to make an enclosure is in the spot that gets the most sun. Check your yard during the day and see what area is in direct sunlight for the most hours per day. The reason is, you can create all the shade you want inside the eclosure with wood overhangs and hide boxes, or even some shrubs or a small potted tree. This way the tortoise can regulate how much sun he gets by himself.

Trust me, in your area, it will not be too hot or too cold for him outside and he will do MUCH better outside all year. They are very adaptable. The thing to remember is, if it does not get cold enough (in the 40s) during the winter for long enough of a time (at least 2 months) in your area, it would be very beneficial to hibernate him in a refrigeration unit of some type. Greeks can and will hibernate, and in fact they really do need to. It is in their nature.