Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was thinking of putting together a Community of different relatively inexpensive(under $25) herps. I wanted to do a more humid enviroment, and a pool of water. Question #1: What is a good size tank for about 3 different small-medium sized species? Question #2: I wanted to put in Small Turtles(Red Eared Sliders,etc.),geckoes(under $25), and/or small lizards(small skinks, anoles, etc), what would be good species to put in the tank? Question #3: What specific areas should i Have for each species and what size should it be? Question #4: How many food/water(i will be misting too) bowls should I have, how many hide boxes? Question #5: What should temperatures be? Question #6: What substrates and decor shoul I use? Thanks!

LizardLuva, your really putting yourself in a real mess. Mixing species will only lead to problems and even death later on. Parasite transfer, stress, and disease will eventually wipe out most or all of your animals. I know some people here mix species, but they are experts, not beginners. They also took the time to carefully research and make sure the habitat is best suited for all the animals. This is done in a VERY big enclosure. Ingo for example (correct me if im wrong) successfully mixed giant day geckos and leaf tails with no problems, but in a huge tank. (right ingo?)

If you want cheap species, anoles and house geckos (i heard) were successfully mixed with no problems, but for a beginner, i would only stick with one, and try breeding them. Also, i reccomend a big enclosure (atleast 50-60g) to even consider mixing them.

To answer your questions, you need to tell us exactly what you plan to get first. Not all species have the same care.

Good luck,
M.N
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Phelsuma Madagascariensis Grandis, Phelsuma Laticauda, Stenodactylus Petrii, Rhacodactylus Ciliatus, Eublepharis Macularius, Anolis Carolinensis, Agalychnis Callidryas, Hyla Cinerea, Mantella Madagascariensis, Dendrobates Azureus, Mantella AurienticaEmail Me

Also, heres a great post by Christina Miller about mixing sp.

"Typically, mixing species is not a good idea, for several reasons:

1- Even if all of the animals are roughly the same size, larger lizards will take dominance over smaller ones, or even may consider the smaller lizards prey (you'd be surprised how large a meal some lizards might go after, especially if they're in a stressful, cramped cage situation). Also, when you first acquire the lizards, they may be the same size, but if you are not familiar with the species, you might end up with one lizard that grows to be twice the size of another. Also, what if one species is more agressive than another? The mellower animals would again end up being picked on, and eventually become ill and die if not eaten.

2- Any "community" terrarium (a term used by fish keepers, any enclosure containing more than one species) must be BIG. Every species must be allowed its own space, its own basking spot, its own hiding spots and its own feeding areas. You'll need at least double the space that you'd usually provide the species who needs the most.

3- Any animals you mix must come from the same habitat. Aside from the absolutely ludicrous idea of mixing desert species with forest species (which, and this should go without saying, NOT be done), even if two animals come from the same place, it does not necessarily mean that their needs are similar. Microhabitats within larger ecosystems are home to tons of species, and the conditions in microhabitats can be drastically different from the rest of the area the animal comes from.
Imagine this example: You have two lizards that live in the Amazon. However, one is a ground-dwelling skink, one is a tree-dwelling gecko. Although they both live in the same forest, the skink needs slightly cooler temperatures, higher humidity, places to burrow... A totally different habitat than the gecko, who lives in the forest canopy, would need different food than the skink, an arboreal set up, different temperatures and humidity, etc... Two very different needs from two animals that come from the same place.

4- Disease is common among many reptile and amphibian species because so many of them are still wild-caught. Bacteria are almost a guarantee (and other microorganisms could possibly be infecting one or more lizards), and even if they happen to be a kind of bacterium that is not harmful to one of the species you are keeping, if the other animals come from the other side of the world, their immunity to this particular organism is likely non-existant, resulting in one or more sick animals who will need to be separated and get veterinary attention.

With all of this in mind... I myself have one mixed-species enclosure in my home. It is a 33-gallon, forest-jungle terrarium, that houses one green anole, Anolis carolinensis, and one Asian flat-tailed house gecko, Cosymbotus platyurus. Both species have similar needs and temperaments, both have been quarantined before being introduced to each other, and as an added bonus: The anole is diurnal, the gecko is nocturnal.

So, even though it's not advisable because there's so many things that can be wrong with a community enclosure, it's still possible to do. Like my terrarium, small, non-tempermental house gecko species and green anoles seem to be fine together if allowed their own space. I've also been told that green anoles and American green tree frogs, Hyla cinera, can co-exist in a properly set up habitat. Although lizards and treefrogs can sometimes co-exist, putting snakes, chelonians (turtles, tortoises and terrapins) and salamanders together with lizards is not a good idea. The vast majority of these animals have care requirements that are too different, and many recognize the other as food.

Also, if you want to mix species, each animal must be properly quarantined for at *least* 60 days (90 is better), and tested for sickness by a vet. For more information on quarantining reptiles and amphibians, see my article: http://www.acc50.attcanada.net/jinx/herps/quarantine.html

Christina Miller"

M.N
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Phelsuma Madagascariensis Grandis, Phelsuma Laticauda, Stenodactylus Petrii, Rhacodactylus Ciliatus, Eublepharis Macularius, Anolis Carolinensis, Agalychnis Callidryas, Hyla Cinerea, Mantella Madagascariensis, Dendrobates Azureus, Mantella AurienticaEmail Me

I typed a huge message on why you shouldnt do it but the server ate it and I dont feel like typing it again. In short, do some research before you even think about putting turtles and lizards together. A huge tank is a must to mix lizards. Geckos and anoles do ok together but the best community setup is composed of different anoles. This is not an easy task as it is and you will need at least 15 gallons of space per lizard given that you dont take into consideration sex or other factors. The best "community" temperature is 85. This is simply the middle ground to many community species.

Mixed species tanks are feasable iif you do your research. only mix compatible parasite free species and use big tanks. I do mix species in almost all of my tanks and since over 30 years this works well for me .
BUT: Never mix turtles and Lizards. Many turtles would not only try to eat lizards, but also constantly infest the tank with Entamoeba invadens which kills all lizards veryx reliably (BTW RES are NOT small turtles).
YOur post does not sound like you are ready to mix species. If you however insist, buy a 30 g tall tank, create a setup for green anoles and oput 1,12 green anoles and 1,1 Hemidactylus turcuicus in it. That mostly works well even for leess experiences. Instead of the Hemidactylus you may choose Hyla cinera, but then you have to tranfer those to an extra tank if you want to breed them.
If you want to spend the money on a tank which is at least 2.5 ft tall AND is long (at least 3 ft) than mix green ANoles with Takydromus sexlineatus.
These are combinations which I may recommend to a beginner.
But a mixed species tasnk always needs a closer eye and a smarter herper than a single species setup.
Even though mixing species sometimes is a better idea than keeping one species pairs of solitary animasl in the same cage... an endless topic

Ci@o

Ingo

You definately need to research turtles more if you're even thinking about them, RES get the size of dinner plates. Even the tiniest turtles need 40 gallons of water as adults.
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Peter: It's OK, I'll handle it. I read a book about something like this.
Brian: Are you sure it was a book? Are you sure it wasn't NOTHING?

I have got a very big communtiy with lots of variety put my tank is huge I had to custom build it its a big L shape im its 5 feet x 2 1/2 feet (thats the rectangular part) and the little extention out of the side is the Pond which is 1 foot x1 foot Now in there I have got a couple fatti tails a marbled 1 blizzard leopard and a marbled gecko also one tree frog and 5 fired bellied toads they have been fine so far no problems but I also have tons of hiding/basking spots it is probly about 400 dollars of furniture/lights maybe even more.

Leopard geckos, AFT's, Marbled's, Vieled chams, treefrogs, and FBT's? Thats NOT a good mix. NONE have the same care. Others are totally opposite. I suggest you to read up on your animals before you mix them. You cant possibly even out theyre care in such a small space.

M.N
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Phelsuma Madagascariensis Grandis, Phelsuma Laticauda, Stenodactylus Petrii, Rhacodactylus Ciliatus, Eublepharis Macularius, Anolis Carolinensis, Agalychnis Callidryas, Hyla Cinerea, Mantella Madagascariensis, Dendrobates Azureus, Mantella AurienticaMy Email

No chameleon in the set up and the reptiles have been fine together the tank is larg enough that it does have a wide variety of temps / hideing spots / basking spots / I can get a digi cam and post a picture if you would like (if I can get my hands on a digi camera) But it is cleaned daily and more then enough food is provided. each lizard has quite some area to themselves. Are you sure problems may occur because up tell now I have had none at all.

Oh, i though this was the same tank.

How long was the setup running? Lots of problems may arrise. I heard leos can get respitory problems when exposed to high humidity, which you need anyway for some of your animals, unless they will get dehydrated. FBT's are toxic, and may lower the Ph in your pond. Not to mention, the leos or fat tails may decide to have a taste of your toads, and end up getting sick.

M.N
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Phelsuma Madagascariensis Grandis, Phelsuma Laticauda, Stenodactylus Petrii, Rhacodactylus Ciliatus, Eublepharis Macularius, Anolis Carolinensis, Agalychnis Callidryas, Hyla Cinerea, Mantella Madagascariensis, Dendrobates Azureus, Mantella AurienticaMy Email

um about a month maybe, the toads stay in the pond and there island on the other side of the pond for the most part. the marbeled usually hang in the trees and the leopards usually hang in hiding spots or basking areas one side is very humid the other is fairly dry. And the one time I saw the gecko venture even near the toads hopped in the water well before he got close. About the PH level its cleaned daily and there is a water fountain. and a water dish that the geckos get there water from on the other end of the tank