Reptile & Amphibian Forums

My hyles lineata pupae are already starting to hatch, a male and a female hatched out last night, and it looks like the rest will hatch outover the next 2-3 days.

How soon should I be feeding them, and how in the world do I do it? I tried to get the female to drink a special butterfly feeder formula(I figured this would be OK for the moths)from a cottonball, but she was way too hyper(even after me cooling her for about 2 mins in the fridge). How soon will they breed?
Thanks for all your help.

Thanks,
Andrew

Hi,
I figured out a way of feeding them that should work, but any suggestions are still welcome. Ill s ee if I can get some pics up, too.

Thanks,
Andrew

This is the cage I am keeping them in. My chameleon has to move out temporarily.

Here is the male:

hey, I didn't know you had a cham! I don't recall seeing you on
the cham forum! What do you have?? I have a 2 y.o. veiled named Luna (can you guess how she got her name )

OK, now to Leps...the things to keep in mind are that they need to hover in order to feed b/c their proboscis (tongue) is so long. I am not sure if your cage has sufficient room for this. I also am not sure if they will nectar on daffodils - but I am sure your selection is limited this time of year (you're in OR or WA, right?)

here is info from Moths of NA website: Adult food: Nectar from a variety of flowers including columbines, larkspurs, petunia, honeysuckle, moonvine, bouncing bet, lilac, clovers, thistles, and Jimpson weed.

as soon as they have mated I would release the male. I do not believe the female will still feed once she begins depositing eggs (prairiedancer may know differently). She will deposit all her eggs within 24-48 hours. Better yet, is keep an eye on her and once she has laid a sufficient amount to provide me, pd and yourself (lol) then let her go to carry on her genetic diversity

hope this helps! btw, I saw your post below just today and replied
your thread

Hi,
Yeah, I dont often visit the chameleon forum. I have a baby flapneck, he doesnt have a name though.

I put wet(with nectar soltion) cottonballs in the dafodils, hoping that that would work. I actually live in Northern California, and spring has definately sprung here. I have a lot of snapdragons too, and so I put some of those in there with the cottonballs in them. I tried handfeeding, and that certainly didnt work.

Hyles Lineata doesnt live in my area, so releasing the male would be a waste(especially since I have 2 more female pupae that should hatch very soon!). I think ill keep him until he dies and then pin him up.

Thanks,
Andrew

Andrew, I think that is an excellent idea. So far, your idea of a "salted" daffodil sounds as logiccal as any. After mating, you may keep the male fresh by cooling in the fridge. Maybe he will mate with another female, but I doubt he will last long enough for a 3rd pairing.
I have yet to actually hand feed sphinx moths, but do know as Lele has said, they definitely need to hover while they are at it.
Just keep us posted on activity and possible ova.

The moths arent breeding, and im pretty sure that they should have by now. Any ideas as to why they wont breed? Or how I can help stimulate them to? Ive heard that you can hand-pair them, but I have also heard that it is extremely difficult to do. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Andrew

Andrew, you can at least try hand-pairing. otherwise, I don't know what to do. The females should be calling and males responding.

do you see the ovipositor sticking out from the female's abdomen? it will look like a little pencil point (this is where the pheromones are released). If so, you can take the male and rub his antennae on it which should stimulate him, then put their abdomens together and he should grab her with his claspers. If she is not "calling" then he will not respond. I know with the wild silks they have very specific times of day/night for calling but do not know about the sphinx so you may just have to keep watch until you see her ovi. Some moths will not mate in captivity. Are they feeding?

Hi,

Nope, I have looked for the females ovipositor before, and never saw it. The moths are finally eating(50/50 water and sugar solution), and so there is still hope that they will breed. They obviously need to feed a few times before they will start calling.

How long do the adult moths live?

Thanks,
Andrew

Andrew,
Unlike the Saturniids which do npot feed and are all about reproduction, the sphingids can live much longer. I know that the Manduca sexta (tobacco hornworm) can live up to about 24 days, but the average is more like 12. So I am guessing the H. lineata are similar. The M.sexta begin to mate within 2 days after eclosing.

I know you mentioned that they don't live in your area (have you looked at the range map?), but if you continue to have trouble, you may want to build a mating cage then release your males. If there are in fact no other males around the ones you have released will find your female. If there are wild ones she may call in a wild male rather than her brother

You can buy a 2'x1' piece of 1/4" hardware cloth, wrap it into a cylinder, attach a piece to cover the bottom, then use something she cannot grasp on to for the top (I use cardboard covered with wax paper). Set it out and see how things go. Just an idea.

Keep us posted! This is quite fun and I look forward to what you are learning, success with feeding and hopefully mating!

here's the CA range map
Link

Nope, from that map it doesnt look like they live in my area. In fact, I dont think anything very interesting lives in my area(I live just outside Sacramento).

Anyways, the moths were feeding great yesterday, I managed to get 3 feedings into them before night, and they fattened up quite a bit. Thats another reasong why I was so surprised to find my male DEAD this morning! I dont have any males left to mate with the females, so I think im pretty much screwed. The females are in paper bags for laying, just in case the male did mate with them, but I dont think he did. Sorry everyone, but I dont think I will be getting any fertile ova from these females.

Thanks for all of your help though.

Thanks,
Andrew

Oh I am sure there is SOMETHING interesting in your area

That is too bad about the males! I wonder why as they usually live for a couple weeks unless they did mate - the males often die first. Well, maybe they did it while you weren't watching

keep us posted!

lele

Andrew, I have heard that lineatas can be found throughout California. I think it's not asking tooo much to set out your females which can draw in males from many miles away. I thought you were in Washington, not California.

I had the 2 remaining females outside is a special "breeding net" for 3 nights. One of the females escaped somehow, and the other one I brought in 2 days ago. I put her in a large oatmeal container, and she laid 3 eggs that night. Last night, she laid 11 more eggs. Do you think that she managed to bring in a wild male? She lays more eggs every night, and that seems like a pretty good sign.

Thanks,
Andrew

P.S. I recieved more S. Ricini eggs, which hatched the other day. The larvae are eating willow, so hopefully ill have more success this time.

Great news! I hope you have fertile ova. I happened to go to Insectnet's forum last night [I rarely visit their forum] and saw where you had posted. I will also try the Petri dish as this is most definitely a learning curve for me as well on actual sphinx breeding.
Where are you getting Samia ricini ova from? I have been wanting some of those myself as I love both the larvae as well as the moths.
A gravid lineata should oviposit up to 1,000 ova, but I seriously doubt the captive rate is as high. I am still interested in some of the ova, too.

Prairie_Dancer, your email is not working. My last female died and I am ready to send you some of the ova.
Please email me at mantidsunlimited@gmail.com

Thanks,
Andrew