Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I've been researching black pine snakes through websites and this forum. I'm learning about the "attitude" and odor of Pituophis. Here are my questions:

1. How would you describe the "attitude" of Pituophis? Is it just hissing noises, bites, and tail rattling?

2. With frequent handling, do adults lose this attitude? Would I need to be concerned about bringing these adults to my elementary school classroom?

3. I've read that Pituophis smell more than kingsnakes and ratsnakes. Does the odor linger or does it disappear after I clean the feces out of the cage?

4. What's the Pituophis feces like compared to my pythons? I've heard that it will be more frequent and more runny compared to the feces of my pythons. Is this true?

Thanks ahead of time.

I've never had a black pine, but I have san diego, sonoran, and cape gophers and they are all like corn snakes, no at all like they would be in the wild. Ofcourse all of them were captive bred and handled since they were hatched. One of my san diegos was real nasty as a baby, but in weeks after gentle handling and feeding her she tamed down and now is like a corn snake. I've heard pine snakes can be more nasty, but if you get a captive bred one that's calm and work with it you'll get good results. Out of all my gophers only one sonoran male musked and it stunk a bit, but that was during mating season and not frequent. The feces of a healthy pit is almost as big as the food it ate. If the snake is healthy it's feces is solid/moist and not runny and easy to scoop up if you use a good substrate.

>>1. How would you describe the "attitude" of Pituophis? Is it just hissing noises, bites, and tail rattling?

Make that closed-mouth bites. Mostly, mine did a lot of snorting and tail-rattling.

>>2. With frequent handling, do adults lose this attitude? Would I need to be concerned about bringing these adults to my elementary school classroom?

Adults are way calmer than hatchlings, if you work with them (or even if you don't -- wild ones can sometimes be quite calm). Obviously, only you would know if a particular animal would mix well with children. This depends on the individual, not the species. I have a cornsnake I wouldn't let kids handle, but a pine snake about six times his size that is a complete dove. So -- use your instincts.

>>3. I've read that Pituophis smell more than kingsnakes and ratsnakes. Does the odor linger or does it disappear after I clean the feces out of the cage?

I clean with Comet liquid bathroom cleaner, that has citric acid as its main ingredient, and no bleach. If I'm just spot cleaning, I remove the waste and soiled substrate, then let the cage stand open for a few minutes. With thirty some-odd snakes, I figure there's always going to be a snaky smell in the room, so I can't say if the odor really lingers.

>>4. What's the Pituophis feces like compared to my pythons? I've heard that it will be more frequent and more runny compared to the feces of my pythons. Is this true?

I believe I answered this one on the General forum. I don't think it's anything to really worry about. The reward of owning a Pit are worth it. Then again, I love Pits, and am probably just biased.

--Naamah

I've had my 10 year old black pine for about a year. I know she was handled quite a bit when she was young. She is very very calm (not what I expected from a pit). I've only been bit once (entirely my fault) and I've never heard her hiss.
Fat BOB

The majority of pits are fairly docile. Those that aren't can be pretty ferocious with their hissing and striking displays, although the only times I have ever been bitten was during feeding time when my hand was mistaken for a rodent. In fact, most of the striking displays occur with mouth closed. Typically they are "touchy" as juveniles but calm down as adults. When handled pits are more active than other colubrids, boas or pythons and require more attention. They don't just sit there like some other snakes.

As far as odor, I don't see any difference in them and any other colubrid. Pines get to be 6'-8', eat large rodents, and seem to metabolize their meals faster. Given those facts, pines tend to defecate more often and larger quantities than other colubrids, excepting perhaps indigos. Generally speaking to maintain good health, a 6' pine will eat a medium rat weekly. Not sure boas/pythons require feedings as frequently.

>I've been researching black pine snakes through websites and this forum. I'm learning about the "attitude" and odor of Pituophis. Here are my questions:

>1. How would you describe the "attitude" of Pituophis? Is it just hissing noises, bites, and tail rattling?

I've had experience with both wild caught and captive bred Pituophis. Most of my experience has been with bullsnakes, though I've had a few black pines, too.

Everything you've read about "attitude" can be true of freshly captured adult bullsnakes. The first bullsnake I met in the wild just about scared me to death. Of course, my buddy and I were 12 at the time, and we'd just rolled a dead tree over her. She was a tad annoyed with us, which I concede was justified. Others I've caught were nice from the moment I saw them.

Most captive bred Pituophis that I've owned were sweethearts, comparable to CB corn snakes (which I've also owned). Even wild caught bullsnakes tame well. When I was in high school, I had a couple of WC that would curl up inside my shirt for a couple of hours at a time. There are individual exceptions, of course.

The black pines that I've owned were as good as the best of my bullsnakes. Black pines really weren't available til around 1975 or later, while bullsnakes, northern pine snakes, and Florida pines have been easy to get since animal dealing began in this country. So most of what you hear about "attitude" is derived from experience with bullsnakes, northern and Florida pines rather than black pines.

>2. With frequent handling, do adults lose this attitude? Would I need to be concerned about bringing these adults to my elementary school classroom?

All I can say is that I have taken both bullsnakes and black pines to elementary school classrooms with no problems. And a friend of mine is a ranger at one of the parks near me and has used tamed wild caught adult bulls in her outdoor classes.

Go for it!

Paul Hollander

My Dad taught Biology and Life Science and still tells storys about the bullsnakes he had in the classroom in the early 1950's.I have never heard of anyone being bitten even though they were wild caught.

When I asked Don Soderburg "How do you know when a bullsnake is going to bite?" and "How bad it was compared to other snakes?" He suggested that half were biters and half were not. As far as how bad he suggested that I let one bite me...then I'd know. So far, knock wood, no matter how big the bluff and show I've never been bit. Prairie kings, Garters, and Racers are more prone to bite(in my experience).

Hope this helps.

Mike B

n/p