Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have helped people with roach and some mice questions here, but never asked any Questions, so now its my turn.

My varanus Niloticus is eating way too much. Mice are out, rats are in. Time to breed.

q.1] I have a 20 gal long tank, which I am sure that I can have 1:1 or 1:2 breeding combo in, right????

q.2] The pet shop here gets hairless rats, so the next few sub-questions are about these.
a.] They always have males, but rarely females, can hairless breed with normals??
b.] Are there any production differences in hairless vs. normals??

q.3] what kind of production can I expect out of one female??? - i.e. pinks per month/pinks per laying/layings per month. I will be suplimenting hissers also, but I need to know how many females I will need for my stud.

q.4] given a 20gal Long, how many could I concievably keep in there, max????

thanx for the help all,

Truth

Sorry, I know nothing about hairless rats, but someone asked about that a couple of weeks ago, so there are some answers out there.

Gallons are not real useful with mammals since they don't use all three dimensions. Think in terms of floor space.

Here are some university guidelines for lab animals.

DeMak
Cagespace guidelines

some hairless rat species are infertile, i have been told.
Right now, i have 3 small 100-120gram rats in a 10 gallon tank...so i would think you could fit 6-7 small rats in an enclosure your talking about. Dont forget to get wheels for the cage, as they will resort to fighting most of the time, they will be busy running and playing with toys, it also keeps them over all happy... I would suggest partioning the 20gallon halfways, and have a 1.2 each half.

i have 3 small 100-120gram rats in a 10 gallon tank...so i would think you could fit 6-7 small rats in an enclosure your talking about. Dont forget to get wheels for the cage, as they will resort to fighting most of the time, they will be busy running and playing with toys, it also keeps them over all happy... I would suggest partioning the 20gallon halfways, and have a 1.2 each half.

If they are young then all they are doing is play fighting. Jumping and running on eachother. It looks like they are fighting but they are not. Only adults fight.

I never use anything. They have nothing to "play" with. Its unnecessary. They usually are too busy humping and weaning babies. I want them to have as much and use all energy toward breeding. I want large production, not "sexy thin rats for the males to hang out with. I want him and her to get down with it and make love 24/7 with looks aside.

Fitting 1:2 in each half would be waaaaay to small for 3 adult rats babies. That is why your rats are fighting. They have no room. No space for the d*mn rat race........If you give them more room they will get enough exercise stealing eachother babies and making new nests all day. At the same time having babies suckling away.......

I have a 20 gal long tank, which I am sure that I can have 1:1 or 1:2 breeding combo in, right????

q.2] The pet shop here gets hairless rats, so the next few sub-questions are about these.
a.] They always have males, but rarely females, can hairless breed with normals??
b.] Are there any production differences in hairless vs. normals??

q.3] what kind of production can I expect out of one female??? - i.e. pinks per month/pinks per laying/layings per month. I will be suplimenting hissers also, but I need to know how many females I will need for my stud.

q.4] given a 20gal Long, how many could I concievably keep in there, max????

thanx for the help all,
1. Yes
2.Hairless from what I understand do not provide enough milk for the young and will starve. If you outcross them then that may eleviate the prob.
3. 1 litter/ 23 dys, I usually average with mine about 10-15. I have a Albigularis albig. and you know that yours and mine eat like there is no tomorrow. I am running 2 males for 7 females. So what I do is when these have babies(usually within days of eachother I stock the 3 females and babies together in one bin. Then in the other bin is the 2 females/1m, and then in my 20gal long I run the 1m/ 2f. I should put the 3 girls in the 20 long as the babies take some space but I got 2 rubbermaid containers from walmart that are slightly wider but .5 or so inches shorter. So technically floor space wise is about the same. For mine, I'll let them get to about the size when they just start eating on their own and then put them for freezing. This month I probably had about 80 rats to freeze. Which is plenty. I also have not had 1 prob swapping the males around. When I clean cages, I just swap the male to the least crowded cage or to the ones who may need to be bred again. So whatever group they are in they usually have babies right about the same time. I also had ALOT of babies from the 3 females litter so yesterday I fed the lizard to check for size req. and then put them down. I then just grabbed a handful and dropped them in the cage where the moms just lost all the babies. Now, they are nursing them. You are going to love rats. Mice are to much of a pain in the a$$.

I forgot 4.
4. I would go more than 3 adults b/c when the babies come around and get some size they tend to take up some floor space. Also, it gets a little smelly but if you had mice then there is no comparison. Once they can eat on their own I trasfer them to a tub that is appx 1/3 the length of a 20 gal lg and a little wider than the 20 is wide. So pretty big for a bunch of babies. They don't stay there long though. Maybe 1 wk to get some grain(corn kernels (dried) sunflower seeds, a slice of bread every other day)), hi-protein dog food, and rabbit pellets, and a hot dog. Every one gets this. The adults ususally get a hot dog every 5-6 days. So yes, 1 hot dog / 3 rats. For raw protein. They love it. You gotta see them running around with it trying to keep it away from the others. I started giving them the hot dog as I noticed alot of the babies with chunks bitten out of them. From the back, the ear, the stomach, etc. I believe the mothers to feel that there is not enough protien to supply enough milk and they were just culling the batch to ensure the survival of the others. So once I started doing the hot dog thing (42c a pack) I noticed it was gone and no more bites. Also, just as for humans, hot dogs are rich in Vitamin B-12. So its good as it has several meats in it ususally making it more balanced......
Today I also threw in the scraps from my chicken legs I made for me last night. I made the pack of 18, ate them all and was quite full, then gave the bones and skin to them. They tore into those too. I also use bones for there teeth. Instead of buying those wood blocks I just put my dogs cattle bones in there. You can get them at a slaughter house and they last for ever, unlike those chew blocks. Then you don't have to worry about teeth problems. If you want some I can mail you a few small ones. They will eat the meat off of it so there will be no rotting.

I do the same with the protein thing.. I give my rats chicken bones, mealworms, superworms, etc.. since I breed all the worms anyway... My rats love supers... I seperate out about 60 of them at a time for a 1.5 cage. Once a week... Haven't had a problem with cannabilism since I started adding that raw protein to the dog food and grains I use as a general feed. All my rodents get the same feed.. gerbils, rats.. hamsters when I have them. All seem to do very well on it too..
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Lucien

1.0 Columbian Redtail Boa (BCI)
2.1 Leopard geckos (2 Blizzard and 1 het Blizzard)
0.1 Savannah Monitor
13 rats
12 Gerbils
2 Dogs
3 cats
1 Albino Corey (fish)

If you are low on females go to Reptile shop and buy female rats. They will sex them for you and some shops give quantity discounts on feeder. As for housing you may want to go to a Swap or Show and consider Rat Lab cages or Multi-level vinly coated wire cages for more ground footage.