Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Got down very late...about 4:00 pm to be exact. This only gave me about 1.5-2 hours to herp, since I promised my wife I'd be home early LOL...I only live four hours away I think I made out pretty well considering my time restraints.

My first two finds were both out amongst the leaf litter along the rocky bluff...

About 10 more minutes into my hike I found this adult beauty...I was very pleased with this find. Some amazing red for an adult syspila (IMHO). This snake was about 24-28" long. I first guessed it to be closer to 18" but I think it was closer to the 20's I mentioned.

One of the last snakes was this small watersnake. It looks big in the pic, but it was only about 8" long. Very aggressive for a little guy.

Finally one of the beautiful Shawnee sunsets over the swamp.

Thanks for looking...I was only 1.5 hours late getting home too ;P

John Eddington

What part of southern Illinois were you in? I was born in Alton. Lived
there for 20 years.

this area in the southwestern portion of Shawnee. Namely the area which is closed off for one month in the Spring and Fall to protect the migration of the herps in the area.

When you going to post some more of your awesome chucks??? LOL

John Eddington

I didn't put 2 and 2 together until you said you had found a albino garter.
I saw a awesome south mountain chuck in August. I didn't have my camera on me. What's up with Shawnee and albino's? I was herping down there in the fall. And some guy shot a albino deer there. To bad.
It would have been awesome to have alive. If you get to many of those
red milks to handle. I have a perfect setup for one.LOL If you get a
chance to come out here next summer. Drop me a e-mail. We can do some herping. Good luck with your albino project.

Nice job john! Love the red milk.
-----
I have:
1.1 Kankakee Bulls
1.0 veild chameleon
1.1 corns
0.1 az king
1.2. tiger sals
0.1.11 fox snakes
0.1.10 thamnophis radix
0.1 3-toe box turtle
0.0.1 gray tree frogs
1.1 Crotaphytus collaris
1.1 Crotaphytus binctores
1.1 Korean Ratsnake
1.1 Goini kings

That is the largest I have seen with that much red. I've found a few small ones which I like to call candy canes for their vivid markings.

I also keep C. collaris and a pair of T. radix. See the garter/ribbon forum. I just posted a pic of the pair I caught Easter Sunday in 2001. I found a small albino male. It was about 8" at the time...probably closer to 28-32 now.

I have 2.4 C. collaris, and 2.2 C. c. auriceps.

John Eddington

I particularly like the garters. The one in the leaves looks like it has quite a bit of green coloration. Do you often find green specimens like that?

The red milk is nice too.

John, really neat photos. I've been down there a couple times but never seen the colorful animals you saw. Did you keep the red milk? I can't believe the color on that guy!! What kind of water snake was that? Looks really dark.

Sincerely,
Greg Henry

No I did not keep the red milk. They are beautiful snakes indeed, but for 1) it is illegal to take anything from a National Forest, and 2) I wouldn't have kept it anyway.
I have only found 6 red milks (maybe 7) in my life, and have not kept any of them...6 of those were not in Shawnee at all, but closer to St. Louis.

Don't get me wrong...I enjoy snakes, but don't want the hassle of trying to acclimate snakes from the wild. I only have two snakes in my house that I have been allowed to keept...No, mom didn't say so, my wife did The two snakes I keep are two T. Radix (Plains garters). One is an albino, so I helf onto the pair.

If I ever do plan to collect a redmilk in the future, it will be from a legal collection site, and also be very young. I personally feel that collecing young is better than the adults. Several babies are picked off by predators, so I don't feel it is doing much harm...collecting an adult, and you've just elimated a few clutches of eggs from the location.

Enough rambling...thanks for the post.

John Eddington

John, thanks for your reply. I didn't know what the laws were in the Shawnee, but I do now. Thanks for the information. I certainly agree that it is easier to raise young snakes than work with wild caught adults, especially with the parasite loads that some adults can have. Some adults never feed well in captivity after being taken from the wild, and it can certainly be a big hassle. Do you know what kind of water snake that dark one was in your photo? Thanks.

Sincerely,
Greg Henry

"mean little sucker" LOL...I really don't know. I could post some pics of it on another forum, and they may ID it easily...try this link...

Watersnake ID

How do I pull up pictures from the boxes with the red X in it. need help, thank you R.B.
Link