Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I do not know how many of you here are TX based, nor should it really matter where a herper is based. Alarmingly I have seen relatively little response to the querry to TX herpers concerning potential legislation in TX concerning exotic venomous and the Nile crocodile. While it is understandable people are slow to respond to unconfirmed statements, some digging I have done confirms the visits by the wardens to several shops. The impending legislation is possibly hidden in a health code as an adendum. I have calls and e-mails into TP&W currently and will post the outcome of those querries. In the mean time, I strongly urge all keepers, whether Texans or not, to start looking up local and state legislators and begin to call or write these people and make them aware of our prescence as a whole. The proposed ban on reptiles and other exotics in Chicago was tabled, that fight is not over, but overwhelming outpour by the herpetological community WORLDWIDE helped accomplish the tabling and the acceptance of the city council to accept help from the CHP in future versions if pursued. A wise man said it best to me via a phone call today, its time to circle the wagons.
RCampbell

I emailed them yesterday, big suprise no responses yet. I will call later today as well and send email to a couple congressman, one I know from the area.

I can't imagine this passing minus being attached to something else. AND they need a grandfather clause and educational loophole to prevent lawsuits from legit businesses.

But anytime legislation is attached to a health bill it has HUGE teeth.
Look at the monkeypox outbreak earlier this year. Not an apidemic by any stretch of the imagination. The fallout.
All african rodents banned from sale. Not just imported pouched rats.ALL african rodents. So you've been breeding zebra mice for 5 years F28. Does'nt matter illegal to sell.
When they say invasive species they mean business.
It makes me mad but it scares me too.
I guess you did'nt get my email.
Big thanks to R Campbell for all the followups.
DC

I agree people are slow to resopnd. This past Legislative season we here in Oregon had one of those laws attempting to pass. Only myself and a few other people wrote lengthy letters explaining the lack of reason behind the law. Our law was scary for the fact it said an emergency existed so it needed to be passed "right away". I wrote a letter to "all" the legislators not to be fooled by this law. We've never had an "incident" in Oregon so where's the emergency. The law was clearly written by the animal rights people not a voice of reason. Fortunately the law wasn't passed but there's always next year.
crocodil

Here is the official e-mail from TP&W...
I am still digging and will advise again when more information is obtained.....

Mr. Campbell;

Your email was forwarded to my staff and me for response.

We're not aware of any proposed laws affecting the species you've mentioned. Texas Parks and Wildlife Department doesn't have the authority to regulate non-indigenous wildlife, so there's nothing TPWD could do about exotic venomous snakes or any crocodilian other than the American Alligator. And TPWD is not proposing any restrictions of native venomous snakes or alligators.

We did create a regulation 4 years ago that requires a person to have a permit if they collect certain nongame species for commercial purposes - that regulation includes native venomous snakes. (See TPWD Administrative Code 65.325-65.332 @ http://info.sos.state.tx.us/pls/pub/readtac$ext.ViewTAC?tac_view=5&ti=31&pt=2&ch=65&sch=O&rl=Y)

I had a similar phone call along the same lines a few weeks ago, from someone in the Dallas-Ft. Worth area indicating they were told it was against the law to sell venomous snakes. I couldn't find any basis for the rumor.

There's a slim possibility that the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture or a local unit of govt. is proposing/has proposed something along those lines that we wouldn't know about (the USDA regulates some aspects on interstate trade in wildlife). But again, I haven't heard anything specific.

John Herron
Program Director, Wildlife Diversity
Texas Parks and Wildlife

here second e-mail today..obviously we are not out of the woods people...they backpeddled a bit when questioned with a few specifics....as promised I will keep all posted...

Mr. Campbell;

Can you give any more details on stores, dates, etc.?

After receiving your email, I double-checked things with my Law Enforcement counterpart - he did indicate that one of our game wardens accompanied a USDA official in a recent visit to a pet store that was being investigated for inadequate facilities. He was tagging along to see if there were any violations of our commercial nongame regulations; the facility issue was a USDA rule and their enforcement concern.

So my impression is that, while one of our game wardens may have visited one or more Austin pet stores, if there's anything pending concerning exotic herps, it might relate to something the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture inspector said. There are several agencies that have potential jurisdiction concerning exotic pets - it's hard to keep us all straight and probably adds to the confusion when we show up at a facility together.

I know that' s not much more help than my initial email. But I can assure you there aren't any new rules coming from Texas Parks and Wildlife.
John Herron
Program Director, Wildlife Diversity
Texas Parks and Wildlife

1

Here is the latest correspondance.....I had asked for the contact information specifically the USDA officer they stated was involved.....and again info has changed from their standpoint......
I will keep all posted as I get info...

Mr. Campbell;

I haven't been able to get the specific contact you requested.

I visited with our game warden who was involved in visits to Austin pet stores this past month. He indicated it was FDA (Food and Drug Administration) staff that were visiting pet stores, looking for compliance with federal regulations concerning sale of turtles (I guess even we get confused about which federal agency is involved). He accompanied them on a few visits to see if folks selling native wildlife species had the proper Texas Parks and Wildlife permit.

He indicated there wasn't any discussion about changing laws, venemous snakes, etc., though he indicated that a pet store that sells a number of venomous snakes did get in trouble for not meeting animal care requirements. I understand that the situation was such that the store was closed and the animals transferred to caretakers. He said he would guess that it would be easy for 'the grapevine' to get the story twisted with folks assuming it was because of the venomous snakes that there was a problem.

Since its a pending case, I don't have access to the detailed information.

Best contact info I could come up with is

Food and Drug Administration
DALLAS DISTRICT
3032 Bryan Street
Dallas, TX 75204
(214) 655-5315

John Herron
Program Director, Wildlife Diversity
Texas Parks and Wildlife

I know just how sloppy government coverage on herps can be. However uneducated the politicians are, they do have a point on creating legislation regarding dangerous species. An outright ban on these animals is not the answer, however there must be some place to draw the line on what animals are for the zoo's. Some provinces in Canada are quite strict on herp ownership, and yet living in them has not restricted my passion for the animals. In fact I believe it has harnessed a larger respect for in what otherwords would be a $50dollar gaboon viper, or $25dollar Burmese python. I do not know the specifics, but I think that Florida has the right idea with it's grandfather clauses and ability to apply for permits with education and mentorship.
Finally, I found it a bit disturbing that the Texas wildlife officer who replied said that there were no laws excluding the capture of native species with the exception of commercial industry. This leaves a huge door for population desecration, improper release procedures, and environmental carnage.
I realize that I may sound overly negative, and by god I do love Texas (wife's family is there), but this is just the sentiment of a fellow herper's values towards both captive and wild herps.

You have to have a permit just to collect. You don't have your permit, you are in trouble if a warden gets to you. There is a seperate, more expensive permit for selling native species, and then there is yet another permit to be able to ship out of state. Andy
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Andy Maddox
Houston Herp Key
The Reptizone

Burgundy baby, With your blue eyed soul, You play the hits and I'm on that roll, Capricorn sister, Freddie Mercury, Jupiter Child cry