Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well, I finally got some good belly shots of one of my hatchlings. The clutch hatched May 16th-18th and all of the babies have had me guessing if they were hypo or not. Dad was an Okeetee and mom was a snow, no more info on either parent. I think maybe all my babies are hypo, which would mean that mom and dad were both het hypo right? Since Mom is a snow, she could be a masked hypo?

I call this a hypo, what do the experts think?





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Dianne
AKA IcedGoddess
0.1 Snow (Ruby)
1.0 Anery A (Breaden)
0.1 Amel (Edana)
0.0.7 Normal het-snow (no names yet)
1.1 Bloodred (Vlad the Impailer and Natasha)
0.1 Anery Stripe (Morticia)
1.0 Candy Cane (Kane)

1.3 Cats (Alexys{f}, Mikki{f}, Timothy{m}, Seven{f})
0.1 Child
1.0 Boyfriend
IcedGoddess Creations
Castle Serpents

Could be het for hypo, but I wouldn't put a hypo/het hypo label on anything based solely on the belly pattern. Call it a normal until you can prove otherwise.

-Kat
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"You keep WHAT in your freezer?"
"Mice. And rats. If that bothers you, I can call them 'cows' instead."

Even if both parents were het hypo, the odds of an entire clutch hatching out as hypo are extremely slim. The pics of the babies don't look hypo at all to me... pretty snakes, but not hypos.
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"You keep WHAT in your freezer?"
"Mice. And rats. If that bothers you, I can call them 'cows' instead."

They look like pretty normals to me too.

Looks like a normal to me. Here's a young w/c corn with similar colors:

If you don't mind me asking, what makes you think they are hypo?

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-audri
Webpage/Pics

They look like really pretty normals to me.

Here is a picture of my W/C 02' normal male. As you can see, his belly checks are very muted grey - they look like he is in shed - but he had just shed the day I took the pictures, that is their color, but he is a normal not a hypo. A lot of times belly checks can help indicate a hypo gene but not all the time.
And to me, the belly checks on yours look normal colored for a normal.

Even with everyone saying they look normal....The pics that are posted as "normals" for examples , to me, don't look at all like my babies...It could be my picture taking, or maybe my imagination, but I can see a ton of orange showing through the black of the belly scales on 4 of my hatchlings, they have an Okeetee father, yet all of them have pencil thin black rings around their blotches. They are only 5 months old and they get less and less black with each shed. The shed skins of 4 of the babies comes out with extremely little black on it, what black there is on the skins is more of a light gray.
I'm not marketing these babies, and the people who do have some of them either know nothing about genetics and don't plan to breed anyway, or don't know I suspect hypo in any of them.
I guess I'll just have to wait and see, I still think I see hypo...

Also, mom is a snow, so for all i know she could be hypo-masked, At least I KNOW they are all double het's for amel and anery

And thanks for all your opinions, even if I didn't like them
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Dianne
AKA IcedGoddess
0.1 Snow (Ruby)
1.0 Anery A (Breaden)
0.1 Amel (Edana)
0.0.7 Normal het-snow (no names yet)
1.1 Bloodred (Vlad the Impailer and Natasha)
0.1 Anery Stripe (Morticia)
1.0 Candy Cane (Kane)

1.3 Cats (Alexys{f}, Mikki{f}, Timothy{m}, Seven{f})
0.1 Child
1.0 Boyfriend
IcedGoddess Creations
Castle Serpents

...that there are morphs of corn that look hypo without carrying a single gene for hypo (think Upper Keys). And again, unless you've got a room full of rabbits' feet, it's extremely unlikely that you got 100 percent hypos from two parents that were het. And that's assuming they're het.

That having been said, there's nothing wrong with normal corns. A good number of keepers suffer from 'my-normal-is-special' syndrome, in which they try to find something about their normal so that they can label it anything other than 'normal'. It happens more often than you think. There's kind of a general mentality in the herp world that something can't be both normal and special, and of course, since people fall in love with their corns, they want everyone else to think they're special too. So they need to find something to call them other than 'normal'.

-Kat
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"You keep WHAT in your freezer?"
"Mice. And rats. If that bothers you, I can call them 'cows' instead."

Even if your snow was homo hypo, you would have gotten about half hypos, unless like Kat said, you have a room full of rabbit feet. I have normals with lighter bellies than some of my hypos, some are light colored dorsally as well, and some are not. I definately have had normals with lighter bellies than some of my hypos even. Lots of factors can cause them to be beautifully light besides hypo. And TBH those belly checks actually look pretty dark, the next step to being any darker would be Okeetee. Here are some pics of some light bellied definate normals, I have some more that are even lighter than these, but this is what I could drag up this morning. Just for your comparison.

lol, sorry for the redundant sentance. Still waken up! Here is another normal belly....

Welcome to the world of confusing cornsnakes!

A Bloodred out cross to me!

That clear centerline is a dead giveaway on those.

If I read your response correctly (and I have been known to be wrong), the reason you think that your babies may be hypo is because they have orange/brown in their belly checks not because the checks are lighter in color. I can understand your thinking that hypo might be the reason because many people think of a normal as having strickly a black and white checked belly. But I have other 'normal' corns that have the orange/brown on their bellies and they are not hypos nor het hypos. It just happens to be the way their belly came out from their particular line.
Here is a picture of the belly of my Okeetee girl that I got from Don S. this spring. You can see that she has a lot of the orangy/brown color in her belly and she is not hypo nor het hypo and comes from strickly Okeetee breeding.
BUT not being hypo does not make your babies any more or less beautiful or desirable. I personally love a good looking normal and have a few of them. Yours could possibly be het hypo or other hets you don't realize, breeding will only tell you that.
Good luck with those great looking normals!!!

Yeah, I guess the dad, who was an Okeetee, had a belly like that too. He also had lighter black than most of the Okee's I see on here, So I guess just his normal influence could account for all of them being so light.

And I don't really care either way if they are or aren't hypo, it's just not knowing anything about the parents lines, The curiosity is driving this cat up the wall! LOL
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Dianne
AKA IcedGoddess
0.1 Snow (Ruby)
1.0 Anery A (Breaden)
0.1 Amel (Edana)
0.0.7 Normal het-snow (no names yet)
1.1 Bloodred (Vlad the Impailer and Natasha)
0.1 Anery Stripe (Morticia)
1.0 Candy Cane (Kane)

1.3 Cats (Alexys{f}, Mikki{f}, Timothy{m}, Seven{f})
0.1 Child
1.0 Boyfriend
IcedGoddess Creations
Castle Serpents

WOW, i typed this really long message and i got booted offline before I could hit submit.

Anyway, just wanted to point out that a picture could look like 4 different corn morphs on several different PCs

I posted digital pic of my butter a while back and everyone on this forum was certain it was an amel (even some of the top pros)....I confirmed that it was a butter but it showed up on others' computers differently due to their PCs color scheme.

Looks like a normal/okee to me BUT ya never know for sure.
Depends on how well the pic represents the animal AND how well it is displayed on our screens.

Just a thought
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"You're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view."

#1 is a Bloodred X Hypo Lav
#2 is a Root Beer...gasp! emoryi-corn
#3 is a banded
I think the Milksnake Phase Ventrals and Dorsals would be a great example as well but I couldn't find any good pics. I don't know what your male looks like now, but the non-motley males I still have definately look hypo on top and bottem. A nice light orange with NO black. Of course, I know they are not hypo. I got to borrow a good camera.

I would have sworn that 3rd one was a Bloodred outcross! Is that banded one that has extremely wide top saddles or one that joins the top saddles to the side saddles?

I believe that hatchling was the type that had the wide top saddle, but I have seen similar belly patterns out of both types of bandeds. Now that I think of it, a lot of these kids with that kind of belly come from my hypo miami. He has large wrap around saddles AND bottom saddles that come up. I crossed him with a "wrap around" banded female with some turning out like dad, some like mom and some not banded at all. But some did have that clean line down the middle. I also bred him with a Crimson that has larger saddles than normal but other than that really nothing special. That was the pairing that gave me the really wierd "bottom saddle coming up" bandeds. And those REALLY have the clear mid section. I called my dad today to ask if he would lend me his digital camera, and to my shock I was met with a firm NO. Then he laughed and told me my sister took it to Hawaii with her! I'll take some belly pics when she gets back with it.

When I said if your snow was homo hypo you'd get half hypos, that is assuming the Okeetee was het.