Reptile & Amphibian Forums

A few days ago I bought an adult pair of Bulls which are about 6.5 ft long. The person who I bought them from seemed almost "anal retentive" about overweight snakes, and had been feeding them 1 med rat every two weeks. To my eyes they seem healthy but slightly underweight,especially the female.The backbone is NOT prominant nor are any bones visible. The body shape is long and slender, more like a carpet python than a Pit.

The male is a stunning yellow over the last 3/4 of his body, A friend of mine has just offered me nearly double the price that I paid for the PAIR for him. Ha Ha...no chance pal
I will post some pics when I get some time.

The question that I would like to ask is .....If I "shovel" the food down them ie 2 or 3 rat weaners every 2 or 3 days so that there is always something digesting until the beginning of December would this be enough feeding before they go to sleep for the winter? I have heard that Pits can go on "fasts" for months at a time but then eat enough in the next month to last them for the next 6 months.I dont want to endanger the snakes but I would like to breed them next year.

Any and all advice is welcome.

P.s If I deserve a roasting over this ..PLEASE be gentle

Peter

Post a picture of it first so we can get an idea of if it is overweight or not. We do tend to keep our snakes too obese in captivity. Most people act like EVERY snake they catch in the wild is skinnt - something must be wrong....lol. Nah, that is just because most people don't often see wild snakes to compare them to captive bred (fat) ones. If all wild snakes look to skinny to someone, maybe the p[roblem is with their collection and not wild snakes? Sorry I got on a soapbox again there, but....

Anyway, I would NOT puch the snakes like you mentioned. Too much food results in obese snakes which is worse than a slightly skinny snake. Obesity is snakes is almost definitely a direct cause of the high rates of dystocia seen in captivity. Don't risk it IMO. Shor-term problems could be regurgiatation. That's worse than anything else since your snake loses energy without getting any back from the food. Pits are bad for getting "Chronic Regurg Syndrom" if you push them too dang hard.

Let me give you an example: I have 2 WC adult male Pituophis that I acquired this year. Both are already in the 6' range. One is from Brewster County and one is from near Abilene, TX. I feed both of them an appropriately sized rat every other week - and they are both GAINING weight! Slow and subtle, but it is happening. I wouldn't believe it if I didn't see it with my own eyes. They weren't skinny when captured, either. This all is making me even rethink what I thought I knew. (I've never been one to believe in power feeding, though.)

KJ

KJ is right on! Just because it can/will doesn't mean we ought to let it. We tend to think bigger is better. But if we refrain we will get a longer period of enjoyment from our charges. I would rather have a skinny snake that lives 20 years than an obese critter that craters at a young age. My older Bulls and Pines get fed every ten to fourteen days. My little guys getseven to ten day feedings and I don't stuff 'em. I've experienced the regurge thing--not a pretty sight! Like KJ, I've noticed weight gain on this "spartan" schedule! I know it's hard to wait for growth but in the long run your snakes will do much better. Just my $.02.

I agree 100%, I have just taken my collection down to feeding an appropriate sized mouse/rat once every 2 weeks. My boas/pythons that have a slower metabolism than colubrids I feed once a month.
My snakes are plump as butterballs and growing steadily. Jeff Robbe

K.J.....you hit the nail on the head with this one!!!!

I too have found out that feeding snakes once a week can even sometimes be too much for my beloved pits.

I used to feed my adult pits, kings, etc, once a week and now, most of my adults are once every other week. Some of my snakes showed starting signs of obesity, like my Applegate gopher. One day I looked at him and couldn't believe it! I put him on a scale down diet of 1 very small adult mouse every two weeks for a few months and it has helped. Now, he is perfect weight, and his color looks better, which is something I have found to be interesting. Obese snakes' colors are not as good as when they are the correct weight. Scales are not stretched out,etc.

My young ones get fed once a week, but I have really saved money as well from not feeding EVERYONE once a week. Good for my wallet AND good for the snake's health.

LATER!
Billy
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Genesis 1:1

Thank you everyone for your replies. I have just re-read my original post and I reads like that i want them to look like "sausages"

NOT TRUE....HONEST..
I was trying to find out if i could put some weight on them in the next 3-4 weeks, enough to last them through the winter but it came out all wrong

This will be the first year that I will be hibernating some of my snakes and I have been "running around like a headless chicken" worrying if they are fat enough. I have read that hibernation can be dangerous if the snakes are underweight, and dont want to endanger them.

I have been monitoring the temperature in the loft and so far this month has dropped to 44f which is too cold and the coldest months are yet to come. I will be building a large wooden box (28W X 36L X 48H) this weekend and will be installing a 35in X 12in heatmat with a mat stat set at the lowest setting to hopefully keep the temp above 50f. I will be hibernating Bullsnakes 1.1 (hopefully) Western Hognoses 1.2 Cali-kings 1.2 Corns 2.2 and my Hog Islands are "at it" now !!!!! Oh happy days ......

I must add that these are not kept in this size container (15 X 20 ). they were put here for the photo's, they are kept in a 48 X 21 X 21 viv

np

Hey Peter!!

These bullsnakes are gorgeous!!!!!! Thanks for sharing pics of them!

In my opininon, their weight is perfect and what I would aim for on a normal basis.

Take care!
Billy
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Genesis 1:1

>>In my opininon, their weight is perfect and what I would aim for on a normal basis.

Yeah, I think those snakes look good. I hate to make a conclusion from one picture since you don't get to see the snake at different angles, but it looks good to me. I think, if I were in your place, I'd try to get that snake up to about 5% more girth or so, so that they'll be perfect for coming OUT of brumation in the spring.

In a good brumation, a healthy snake should lose no more than 3% of their body weight. I haven't seen it, but I've heard of a snake gaining weight during brumation. This "has" to be due toi a gain in water weight (i.e., the snake drank some water before it was weighed), but it shows that a good brumation results in negligible loss in body mass.

Looks like the previous keeper had the right idea. In the spring, since you will be breeding, you might want to feed the female a more often (since she'll lose a lot of weight laying the eggs) and the malea LITTLE more often since he might stop eating for a couple of months when the female starts cycling. The feeding regime for a breeding and nonbreeding snake is the same. However it is done, the body mass should be similar to the way the snakes in those photos look to me.

Good Luck,
KJ

Thanks everyone for your advice. I will now have to look at the feeding regime of the rest of the collection. I have got a few sausages that need slimming down

Thanks again Peter

a small rat every tuesday except when in shed with no problems. I cannot answer how that will affect hibernation as mine stay hot and eat year round. Just a guess that if you feed every 5 to 7 days they will be ok. Before you hibernate them let them empty up for 2 to 3 weeks. Make sure they have water. Hope this helps.

Mike B