Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hello Marchel
We had a discussion about amelbloodredmotley you now.
Go to South Mountain reptiles in the corn there is a Motley sunglow.
This is the same snake from the same line those that i have are sisters and brothers from them.
You see that animals from Holland go to Amerika and they give them a new name and we have a new snakescolour,and that is what i ment the big snakebreeders can do that we not.

greating Jan

If your post presumed that my sun motleys originated from European stock, that is not the case. I've been breeding this particular line since the mid 1980s. I bred the best of my sunglows to motleys and finally came up with animals that you see today on my site. Same with most of my amelanistic bloodreds. Started with amelanistics and bloodreds and worked up from there. If any of my founding stock came from Europe, I'd gladly say so.

The only places I've sold these two morphs outside the U.S. are Canada, Isrial and Japan so it's possible, but doubtful that my lines are even over there. Not being naive, I'm sure some have "hopped" from one place to another and ended up there, but not directly from me. I do recall selling some snakes to someone in Europe three years ago, but he hasn't had time to produce many from them. I think the insinuation was that mine came from there so that point is moot anyway.

Since I've never sold my animals in Orlando or Daytona, Europeans would have to have come to little shows in the Midwestern U.S. to get my stock if they didn't order them via email or phone to be shipped. I can assure you that my amelanistic bloodreds and my sun motleys were "created" here and started from scratch. I've never purchased any animals from Europe and never from anyone that said they were Europe. My humble snake breedings started in Wichita, Kansas in the 70s and in "DooDah, Kansas" people don't import corn snakes from Europe.

Just setting things straight.

Don Soderberg
South Mountain Reptiles
www.cornsnake.NET
South Mountain Reptiles

...over in Europe the breeders there are more guilty of making up or misusing morph names. An amel with yellow background will suddenly become an Amber or some other name which is already in use for a specific genetic combination. I'm not sure whether it's a result of confusion about what the morph names really mean, or they're just looking to make a quick buck, but it happens, and from what I understand, it happens far more over in Europe than it does in the US...

Thus, doing your homework before buying or selling a morph is always important.

-Kat
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"You keep WHAT in your freezer?"
"Mice. And rats. If that bothers you, I can call them 'cows' instead."

I hear the same thing. A friend of mine in Europe says it's bad over there. Says when she goes to shows there, the misrepresentation is rampent and sometimes embarrassing. I don't see how it could be accidental with the Internet making making visual identification so accessible. Perhaps when folks have bought snakes that were sold as ambers, they swear up and down the babies are ambers regardless of their appearance. Can't really blame them for that as long as they're open minded about criticism. Others are probably claiming their babies are from this or that large breeeder just to get more money. Shrug??

Thanks for your comments,

Don
www.cornsnakes.NET
South Mountain Reptiles

your sunglow motley line not only came from europe , but they are actualy amel motley bloodreds.I'm quessing if they where bloodred you would want to let everyone know that , considering the popularity of boolreds.
anyway , i'm currious now if bloodred was used in any way to produce either the sunglow or sunglow motleys.
one more thing. I have three amel motleys and one amel with no white is that enough to consider them sunglows?
thank for any help,Jason(griffindor)

I just wanted to respond to all angles of the subject to save posts. I don't frequent this forum too much and try to answer posts in more than one direction.

I just wanted to point out that I started my sunglow motleys from scratch and never bred bloodreds or anything else into them. Just started out with deep orange, low white amelanistic corns (sunglows) and motleys. Nothing else. Personally, I've never bred bloodreds into this line, but it probably wouldn't be a bad idea. I'm thinking it will take me further from my goal of making albino bloodreds red instead of orange. It is very hard to do that and most of all the albino bloodreds out there are orange including most of mine.

Long story short. My line goes back to the early 80s and has never had European bloodlines in them that I'm remotely aware of AND I never bred bloodreds into them. Since I have never hatched a single thing other than sunglow motleys from them, it is clear to me they have no bloodred genetics in them.
South Mountain Reptiles

I know many people in Europe saying they have Lavender stripes, Bloodred Motleys, Hypo Bloodreds and all they have are Anery stripe, Normal Bloodred etc etc. I was suckered into buying a Bloodred Motley two years ago but luckily you guys out here pointed out it could not be a Bloodred Motley. The Belgic seller still thinks he sold me Bloodred Motley. I don't know if it is ignorance or pure fraud.

Marcel

>>I hear the same thing. A friend of mine in Europe says it's bad over there. Says when she goes to shows there, the misrepresentation is rampent and sometimes embarrassing. I don't see how it could be accidental with the Internet making making visual identification so accessible. Perhaps when folks have bought snakes that were sold as ambers, they swear up and down the babies are ambers regardless of their appearance. Can't really blame them for that as long as they're open minded about criticism. Others are probably claiming their babies are from this or that large breeeder just to get more money. Shrug??
>>
>>Thanks for your comments,
>>
>>Don
>>www.cornsnakes.NET
>>South Mountain Reptiles
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Marcel Poots (Holland)
'Where is your crown King Nothing?' James Hettfield

Hello Don

There are people that say here that these anymals came from pablo and he is a breeder in holland.
I have those anymals and they look exakly the same but here they where sold as amelbloodredmotley.
I posted some pics 1/2 year ago and thet make a disc becouse there where lampro in it,and that is tru but it was 4 generations back.
Here there are saying that the animals that you have on your site are imported from europe from the line from pablo,and there are amerikan breedrers who say the same.
I don't try to break yours down i will get i line in some anymals and that seems to bee very dif.

Greating Jan

www.slangenbroed.nl

Whoever is saying that Don's snakes are imported from holland is obviously seriously misled, or outright lying. He's stated enough times that he has been breeding this line since the mid-eighties. Which would be much more than 4 generations. You've been misinformed.
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Dianne
AKA IcedGoddess
0.1 Snow (Ruby)
1.0 Anery A (Breaden)
0.0.4 Normal het-snow (no names yet)
1.1 Bloodred (Vlad the Impailer and Natasha)
0.1 Anery Stripe (Morticia)
1.0 Candy Cane (Kane)
0.1 Amel (Christine)
1.3 Cats (Alexys{f}, Mikki{f}, Timothy{m}, Seven{f})
0.1 Child
IcedGoddess Creations
Castle Serpents

. . . but everyone saying that is wrong. I started those lines here from scratch. I've never heard of Pablo. I'd love to hear what American breeders are saying that so I can personally inform them of the truth. Regarding Europe. I'll never be able to convince any of them that I have never had a European line of corns, but since I don't sell there it doesn't matter. I would however like to clear this up here in the states.

Thank you for your honesty. Translate and print this off to show anyone over there what I have personally testified to. Of course, they're welcome to ask me personally, but those two bloodlines of corns originated right here at South Mountain Reptiles

Don
www.cornsnake.NET
South Mountain Reptiles

well this is certainly an interesting post. If I am reading this right, I take from Jan's post that she is saying that the picture of your sunglow motley on your web page is a sibling to her amel bloodred motley??? And you had it imported from Holland? And then you renamed it a Sunglow Motley??
Hmmmmm.....man, Don, you certainly know how to undercut yourself, don't you. I didn't know that you were so rich as to want to sell a morph, that to my knowledge there are none of, and sell it as a sunglow. I always thought you were a nice person, but that is just super generous.
Seriously, as far as I know, there are no proven blood mots yet are there?

>>Seriously, as far as I know, there are no proven blood mots yet are there?

LOL, I haven't seen them eighter and I am devoting my life to producing one I am trying to make hets this spring. I know Darin Chappel has produced Amel, Motley, Bloodred hets this year and Don Motley Bloodred hets already before this year. I was very impressed with Richard Hume's Bloodred stripes. That is quite an achievement too.

Marcel
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Marcel Poots (Holland)
'Where is your crown King Nothing?' James Hettfield

Well, nobody can say for sure where their bloodlines originate so I'd never swear that I don't have this or that in my genetic recipes. Since mine go back so far and have never been out of my control, I deduce certain things. Like having hatched hundreds of them without a single bloodred. Regarding the origins of my animals, it's difficult for me to believe that cutting edge corns were commonly exported to the U.S. from Europe back in the 80s. Even amel. motleys were rare back then. I'm not entirely sure sunglows were named at that time then. I called sunglows orange/orange amels. back then. I called my reverse Okeetees "high white" amels.. I didn't know those names existed back then. The other thing that makes it unlikely that my lines were related to European lines is that Kansas wasn't exactly the mecca for corn snake breeding. It would take many generations of breeding and selling for those to make their way to Kansas if any were being imported from Europe.

Given the "guppy syndrome" nature of captive bred corns, it would be hard to say where most of our bloodlines originated. If someone proved to me that any of my lines were from stock other than U.S. bred ones, I'd happily advertise it. Personally, I don't care where they came from.

Jan,

Why do you think that? Yours are hybrids. I don't think Don is selling hybrids as pure corns. I know as a fact Don is trying for several years now to produce Bloodred Motleys. I know you think that almost all morphs come from other ratsnakes and that would justify to call them corns. I think some frosted corns come from ratsnakes but most morphs today are pure corns. I do think it is an interesting topic however. Many people have asked you to make detailed pictures of your Bloodred Motleys. Now seems a good point to do so.

Marcel

>>Hello Marchel
>>We had a discussion about amelbloodredmotley you now.
>>Go to South Mountain reptiles in the corn there is a Motley sunglow.
>>This is the same snake from the same line those that i have are sisters and brothers from them.
>>You see that animals from Holland go to Amerika and they give them a new name and we have a new snakescolour,and that is what i ment the big snakebreeders can do that we not.
>>
>>greating Jan
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Marcel Poots (Holland)
'Where is your crown King Nothing?' James Hettfield

The ones sold to me where sold as amelbloodredmotley you now that to and there are lampro in that line but i was 6 years ago that this happend this info i have from the breeder himself.
Now i saw the pic on the site from don and i ask severel people where they came from and not only in europe but also in the states they say the came from the stock from paplo in holland.

I will post a pic furst i must make one

greatings Jan

>>The ones sold to me where sold as amelbloodredmotley you now that to and there are lampro in that line but i was 6 years ago that this happend this info i have from the breeder himself.
>>Now i saw the pic on the site from don and i ask severel people where they came from and not only in europe but also in the states they say the came from the stock from paplo in holland.
>>
>>I will post a pic furst i must make one
>>
>>greatings Jan
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Remember, my posts are MY opinion only.
Jimmy (draybar)

i found this on a Google search labeled Sunglow Motley Corn

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0.0.1 pacific gopher snake ; Mich
0.0.1 amel corn snake ; Andy
0.0.1 motley corn snake ; Shmee

I think most Amel Motleys look like Sunglows. Here is my normal Amel Motley. She is as good as it gets when it comes to Sunglow.

Marcel

>>i found this on a Google search labeled Sunglow Motley Corn

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Marcel Poots (Holland)
'Where is your crown King Nothing?' James Hettfield