Reptile & Amphibian Forums

No expert, I need to know some tricks to the trade about taking care of bullfrogs.

I raised a couple of giants before, but lack live foods where I live since crickets and earthworms are unavailable in South Korea, and am now in the midst of raising another. It's medium grown but past the puny insect size morsels I've fed it by hand. These included dragonflies, pillbugs, wild crickets, caterpillars, or grubs, flies and worms. Now I'm into fish, and skeptical.

Someone said feeder goldfish aren't any good. Parasites. Then I switched to frozen anchovies, or minnows, but someone said again these are 'Thiamine-deficient' or something or anoter if feed too much. Yet its my staple right now. This and a couple of small sticks of Turtle ReptoMin stuffed inside.

But what else can I do? I'm stuck. Looking for other foods any one might've experimented with here, particularly foods not live. I can use fish and present it live. But I need something more than fish to prevent a thiamine deficiency.

Hi,

Goldfish and minnow type fish comtain an enzyme called thiaminase when they are alive or un-cooked, thiaminase enzyme hydrolyses thiamine (Vit B1) which will cause your frog to have a vitamin B deficiency. The fish are fine if they are gently cooked to de-nature the enzymes so that they don't function any more, making them safe to feed to your frog.

Hope this helps,

Chris.

How about after being frozen a while? Or what if I feed them a little Turtle ReptoMin stuffed in the fish? Or feed them fish every other day?

Freezing will destroy some of the enzymes, but some may survive so it's a good idea to warm the fish in a microwave before feeding, reptomin sticks are good and you can feed those inside if you like. If you fed raw fish then you could feed every 3 days and supplement with a Vitamin B supplement,krill or any other high Vit B food.

Chris.

I gently cooked some last night, but wonder. What do you mean by "gently cooking them?"

I boiled a few minnows for about two minutes. fed one to my bullfrog and she ate it. But I don't understand. Freezing doesn't kill all the enzymes? So that's why I must boil?

Need to know more.

When I say gently cook I mean cook at a temperature above 90'c for several mintues or until the whole fish is hot through. Enzymes are never really alive, they are made up of molecules and reactions happen on areas of the enzymes called active sites, the reactant (e.g Vitamin B) bonds to this site and is broken down. The active sites have a specific shape and only certain things e.g. Vitamin B can fit into the area and be hydrolised (broken down), a bit like putting a key in a lock, only one type will fit. When the enzymes are heated the molecules making up the enzyme start to vibrate and the weak bonds between them break, destroying the active site's shape so no Vitamin B can attach and be destroyed. When the enzymes are cooled no movement occurs so the enzymes are not destroyed. Sorry if that was a bit of an information overload!

Chris.

No, this was great. Don't be sorry for the overload. I needed an explanation, and you gave one.

Does this pertain to "all" fish though? I'd like to know what fish doesn't destroy these enzymes, even when not boiled. I heard bluegills are okay. How about some tropical fish that are cheap to come buy?

Oh, and one more question, if you have the time. I find these certain inchworm-like caterpillars, only a lot bigger, that are in season where I live now. They're about 2-3 inches in length. I don't know what they could be, but my bullfrog eats them. Do you have any idea as to what they might be or what nutrients they might contain? They're kind of opaque, like larvae, have a little brown face and brownish rings. So far they've proved safe.

Hi,

The catapillars sound fine but I'm sorry I wouldn't have a clue what they are or what protein they contain, you might like to contact your local wildlife agency or entomologist. It's only Goldfish and Minnow type fish whihc contain the damaging enzyme. Guppies and Livebearers are fine and so are saltwater silversides/whitebait.

Chris

What about anchovies? Sardines?

I find these unseasoned and unsalted at the store here.

Anchovies probably too salty but the sardines should be OK as long as they are not in a sauce or in oil.

Chris.

Thanks again Chris. Now what about mice, or other life forms? I know bullfrogs can turn into monsters, and I need some parental guidance for this one.

Last year I fed one shrimp, deshelled clams, eels, and some large sardines here I didn't know the name of. I couldn't find him anything else once he got too big.

Hi,

Mice are ok in moderation as are all the other food that you suggest.

Chris.

Thanks Chris. This thread is getting kind of long, so maybe we should sign out. I'll start another one here soon and hope you can respond, for your information has been very helpful.

You seem like a real frog person, too, and I just wanted to ask you to give me any advice as to what I should watch out for when raising bullfrogs. Got to go here.

Yeah, Im a frog kind of person, but mainly African Clawed Frogs. Here's a link whihc may help you with raising bullfrogs:
http://www.bullfrogs-louisiana.com/

Chris.
Bull Frogs Louisiana.