Reptile & Amphibian Forums

My little colony is going ok, despite my recent "minimalist" approach to chameleon keeping. I'm feeding, watering , checking, watching, and leaving. I'm not spending much time with them, just enough to make sure everything's running well.

I've noticed some funny things. My one female is becoming receptive to the male, following him, while the other female is chasing him. I have their enclosure divided into 2 sections, with the divider only halfway the width, allowing movement to wither side, bt visual separation once at each side.

This was a bit of an experiment, and it's been very interesting. Although no mating has occured(probably because of the lower than optimal humidity--getting a mister system for christmas), the behavior has been interesting.

the male is starting to pace his territory, now encompassing BOTH sides, but he tends to hang out withth e friendly female.

In my other enclosure, shared by two sub adults, things have gotten bad, Although it's a VERY big space, and very heavily planted, my little male has become abusive. I removed two of the trees, and placed them just outside the enclosure(so they could move in and out of it, giving them about 3'X8' of floorspace area, and no walls), and the male continued to chase her to the ground. Time to separate. AND teach him a lesson in humility. Let him know who's boss.

So, I introduced him to the adults. The adults get upset when he's within 2-3 feet of them, or at eye level. The females displayed, and he moved down. The male simply charged. He lowered his head and charged, chasing him to the bottom plants, the bushes. then, everything returned to normal. the little male stays low, the adults stay high. the big male patrols his territory out in the open, the little male stays in the bushes.

The enclosure is completly open, free range with plastic sides and a foot high barrier, to keep them on that side of the room.
They have nearly the entire side of the room to themsleves.

Since I have introduced the abusive little dirtbag, my male has rapidly improved his behavior. Since his eye problem, he has not eaten more than one insect every 2-3 days, and has NOT MOVED from a single branch group. I even had to drip water ON HIS HEAD to get him to drink. Now, he's eating more, moving around all the time, and is not avoiding the females like before--he was cowering in the bushes right after his sickness.

I have heard that deremensis sometimes need a kick in the rear( another male to intimidate) to get started in courtship displays. Does something for their self-esteem. I tried using a mirror, and that worked while I was there, but having the little one around seems to be working better.

I have the thing set up so that if he is too intimidated, he can escape. IF they go to the ground, they can get out, and the little female was doing this when the male was chasing her. So far, the little guy has not been run out, and the little female has been feeling much better too.

I wish I could do this with my veilds...to bad they'd kill each other.

Deremensis are funny little guys. What you are seeing sounds so familiar. I didn't have breeding pairs, but my male was quite tempermental with life in general. He would go into sulks, lose his confidence, then turn into Mr. Macho when he met up with the male fischeri who shared his huge cage. One minute he was ordering the fischeri around and the next they were perched on the same branch for the night. I also think the reality of competition can turn a sulky depressed animal into a more active and "normal" one. It may be an example of "good stress". Thanks for your interesting post!

I see the same behavior with my male. Since I introduced the little guy, the 3 of them(two males and the big female) have stayed on the smaller side of the enclosure, and the smaller, less freindly female by herself. This is their sleeping arrangment. The little male stays RIGHT BY the big one, about 6 inches to a foot away, but underneath. during the day, the big guy cruises, patrolling, equally on both sides of the enclosure.

This is getting interesting. I'm seeing intraspecific behavior among some animals that are usually kept singly. It's so interesting.

Right now, I have an entire 12 foot side of the room sealed up for my animals, and the big section is about 6-7 feet long, 3 feet deep. I have a 3 foot section for the little deremensis(now only one female) and another 3 foot section for my veild.

I'm thinking about putting up a cage for the veild, o the other side. He's about 18" and evil, so I HAD to ruin the design of my enclosure by screening in his end--my deremensis get out quite often ,but no big deal. if HE got out, he'd kill the male, eat the little ones, and do lord knows what to the females...

SO, If I re-move him, I could have a 12 foot X 3 foot pretty much walless enclosure.......oh that sounds like a good idea.....

Hey, do you know if spanish moss is toxic? I need ot check...I wanted to use in in my enclosures, I can pull it off of some live oaks when I got to wilmington.

E

I think I've read that there is some concern about using it for herps. What the problem was I am not sure, but it may have been ingestion. Some mosses have tiny hard spiny segments that can get lodged in respiratory or digestive tracts...if it got very dry maybe it could travel in air? Don't trust me, look up any cautions.