Reptile & Amphibian Forums

n/p
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Chris

1.2.0 Bearded Dragons
1.2.0 Green Basilisks
1.1.0 Crested Geckos
1.2.0 Veiled Chameleons
1.1.0 Corn Snakes
1.0.0 Tokay Geckos
0.0.1 California Kingsnakes
2.5.1 Leopard Geckos

There are a few people on this forum including myself that do not use UVB bulbs. There are also several large scale breeders that do not either. I use spot bulbs for basking spots and plain floursecent tubes to create extra light intensity in my cages. I use supplement with the t-rex Sandfire superfoods only. There are 3 products put out by them 2 veggie supps. and one Insect dust. All 3 contain 4000 I.U. of d3/ kilo of product. This is safe safe level for daily use. Miner-all I also contains about the same amounts of d3/kilo. Rep-cal contains 400,000 I.U./ kilo. This is a product you might not want to use as liberally, although I know people who have and do with out problems. There seems to be a pretty large margin of error when supplementing with the powder calcium supps. that contain d3. More often than not people tend to under supp. and run into problems.

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Bill DiFabio
Azteclizard.com
Email Me

How might I go about switching them to a supplement and how much should I supplement. Which is the best supplement to use?

Currently we've supplemented our chameleons with Reptivite (Zoo Med) and have had no problems in all the years we've had them...they do get sunlight but only through a window or screen occasionally.

The bearded dragons, I find that the 8.0 and 5.0 bulbs wear down too fast, are far to expensive and don't actually work all that well...I'd love to just switch over and supplement them instead...what's the best way to go about this???
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Chris

1.2.0 Bearded Dragons
1.2.0 Green Basilisks
1.1.0 Crested Geckos
1.2.0 Veiled Chameleons
1.1.0 Corn Snakes
1.0.0 Tokay Geckos
0.0.1 California Kingsnakes
2.5.1 Leopard Geckos

Just get a good supplement and use it. Like I said in my previous post, miner-all I and the t-rex dragons supps. contain a level of d3 that works for daily use. I prefer the t-rex supps. because they contain macro and micro nutrients that benefit your dragon much more than a plain calcium supp. You can use rep-cal with d3 also but I would not use it as liberally as I do with these other supps. If you have the bulbs already, use them, you spent the money already. When they fizz out, just replace them with regular flourescent bulbs from a hardware store.
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Bill DiFabio
Azteclizard.com
Email Me

Sure there are some people who feel that the supplementation of calcium and d3, and a good diet with high light intensity is all that is needed. I personally don't agree fully with this, and use both high intensity lighting both UVA & UVB producing lights, and supplement their live feedings with rep-cal cal and d3. I personally would never just supplement d3 or just use UVB lighting by themselves. I use both in conjunction and all my dragons grow nice and big, are healthy, and their vet is very pleased with their overall health, bone formation and strength. Could I be taking unneeded precautions with my beardies health? It's possible, but I believe my pets benefit greatly from both used together more then they would with any one used alone. If your going to go through with feeding a great wide variety diets daily, and supplement each meal. Why not take an added step of once every 6 months putting in a 14 dollar uvb producing bulb in the fixture if all it could do is benefit the dragon, and ensure his health & happiness?
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Mystical Dragons webshots pictures
Mystical-Dragons Website

use it and produce nice looking, colorfull, healthy dragons. I just don't want to take a chance on screwing up again myself....
Like the substrate thing it all boils down to what works best for you in your application of husbandry. If you do go with no UVB make sure you study up on what kind of problems this COULD cause and watch for them as a safety precaution.

Robert WOod

Unfortunately, once you actually "see" the symptoms of MBD it is way too late.

Wendy
Scales - Premium Exotic Lizards

I agree with Wendy. It is to my understanding that reptiles NEED the UVB to properly metabolize the calcium. The deadly rays from the sun that cause us humans skin cancer & sun-poisoning is the same UVB that diurnal reptiles have to have. Now I know that many herpers will disagree with me. I've seen the debates on this forum many times, but personally, I feel like it's not worth taking the risk to not provide the proper lighting. How many of the people that don't use it have ever found it in a book written by TRUE EXPERTS stating that you can supplement & not use UVB? I use both, the calcium w/D3 and the UVB.
Wendy is also right in stating the fact that it's too late once you see the signs of MBD. Don't take chances with your beardies health. They depend on you.
Cricket

"How many of the people that don't use it have ever found it
in a book written by TRUE EXPERTS stating that you can supplement & not use UVB?"

Funny you shoud ask. One of the co-authors of the BD manual that contributed to the section on diet and nutrition seems to feel that dietary d3 is sufficient for reptiles to utilize calcium. I had a phone conversation with her today on the very subject. Her web site is herpnutrition.com. Check it out and ask her if UVB lighting is essential for captive reptiles to "absorb" calcium. She is a "true expert" after all.
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Bill DiFabio
Azteclizard.com
Email Me

to supplement dragons...I'm going to go ahead and try it since I have many animals, it's cost efficient and some people believe it is much better than the lights...I am a firm believer that the lights we buy in stores are USELESS! They only work when the dragon is a foot away! Powersun bulbs are made from mercury and if they break...that's trouble!
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Chris

1.2.0 Bearded Dragons
1.2.0 Green Basilisks
1.1.0 Crested Geckos
1.2.0 Veiled Chameleons
1.1.0 Corn Snakes
1.0.0 Tokay Geckos
0.0.1 California Kingsnakes
2.5.1 Leopard Geckos