Reptile & Amphibian Forums

i was just wondering what everyone (especailly breeders) here thinks about inbreeding? also, i've heard the term 'line-breeding,' is this any different from inbreeding?

just to add my two cents, i'm against inbreeding in general (i can't help it, i have a background in population biology, ), but i wanted to hear what other people had to say about it, specifically in leopard gecko terms. i mean, i know it's how a lot of the major genetic mutations (albinism/s, etc.) got going initially, in other species as well. i've also seen some breeders openly selling siblings and parent/offspring as pairs for breeding.

i plan on breeding soon-ish myself. i'm trying to avoid inbreeding, but it's so hard to know if two geckoes, from two different breeders (or the same one), are related. does anyone know off-hand of any breeders that make a point of not inbreeding their lines? (i'm always afraid to ask breeders if they practice inbreeding, because i'm afraid they'll get mad or insulted...)
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marla
keeper of: axolotls, catfish, ferrets, leopard geckoes, oriental fire-bellied toads, and sugar gliders

Inbreeding is negative to almost every living thing I know of with the exception of ants.

I think it is a purposely valid point to ask any breeder.

But I think the negative impacts are overly exagerrated... I simulated inbreeding in a virtual life game (had dna structures) and the first negative defects only happened after 32 generations of sibling inbreeding (guy was brain dead)

The way I understand linebreeding is that it's breeding to exaggerate a certain trait. Like if you wanted a gigantic leo you'd breed big leos to big leos. It can include inbreeding, and usually does, but doesn't necessarily have to. That's just how I understand the definition.
I don't believe inbreeding for a few generations is likely to be detrimental, only because there are populations of herp species in this country, like bearded dragons, who have an incredibly small founder population but are still doing ok. I still like to avoid it as much as possible, but it's a fact of life when you're breeding morphs or rarer species.
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"The serpent crams itself with animal life that is often warm and vibrant, to prolong an existence in which we detect no joy and no emotion. It reveals the depth to which evolution can sink when it takes the downward path and strips animals to the irreducible minimum able to perpetuate a predatory life in its naked horror."
Alexander Skutch

I think the term line breeding is a more sophisticated way of saying inbreeding. I always get a picture in my head of those two dueling-banjo guys from the movie 'Deliverance' whenever I hear the term inbreeding! LOL!

If you have studied population biology, then you know that the lower the life-form, the less impact inbreeding has on genetic defects. I understand the perceived necessity to line breed in order to achieve more desireable traits in the fewest number of generations, but I personally do not practice this. I feel I have a professional and ethical responsibility to strengthen the species by out crossing the more desirable characteristics instead. Unfortunately, this approach will certainly not win me any awards for coming up with any new color morphs in a short period of time!
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Marcia McGuiness
Golden Gate Geckos
www.goldengategeckos.com

Some times you will get good traits out of it like the albino, giant, snow...Line breeding is "Selective inbreeding to perpetuate certain desired qualities or characteristics in a strain of livestock."
In other words, just Selective breeding.

Inbreeding is a natural thing especially in reptiles...... Reptiles do not migrate...... They pretty much stay in one area for their entire life......There is a population of timbers by me and there is not another pocket of them for about 80 miles..... Can you tell me that there is no inbreeding going on????? How about the Komodo dragon???? Do you think for a secod that there is no inbreeding going on on those islands???? Inbreeding in reps is not a bad thing...... The same deformaties you get in captive bred babies are found in wild populations too..... The differance is in the wild the deformed or mutated animals are dispatched pretty fast and do not have the chance to pass on the defective gene...... This is not the case all the time....... There are mutations that can be in just a certain population pocket that actually worked out to be an atvantage...... You can call that a locality spacific reccessive trait........ And something like that can only happen when there is alot of inbreeding......

I think u will see less deformities in reptiles then in higher evolved animals, such as mammals. If u think about the galapagos islands, all those animals must be inbreeding, expecially the tortoises, but like certian species of mamals, like the golden marmoset, they breed in only in certain groups, and are declining due to inbreeding, and weaker individuals.
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1.2.1 Leopard Geks
1.0.1 High Yellow, 0.1 Blizzard, 0.1 Normal
2 White's Treefrogs
2.1 Fire Bellied Toads
0.0.2 Red Eared Sliders
1 Spotted Tail Warty Newt
Fish:
0.2 Parrot Cichlids
1 Upside Down Catfish
0.0.2 Bullhead Catfish
1 Geophagus jurupari
1 Fire Barb
0.0.4 Blue Gouramis
Goldfish

Herpin since 93'