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BURMESE PYTHONS DANGEROUS????

cv768 Jan 28, 2004 02:54 PM

Alright, seeing as I'm in a city with a dumbass bylaw banning the keeping of all boas and pythons...yup I said ALL...I won't be able to own any of them anytime soon without a minimal risk of a large fine and confiscation of the animal.

However, we will be moving outside of city limits someday within the next year or two and I am going to get my hands on burmese and ball pythons...we've kept every colubrid possible and absolutely love keeping and breeding snakes...

Now, I don't mind if a snake is overly aggressive (biting, deficating, hissing) but I read Melissa Kaplan's article on Burmese pythons and she almost discouraged me from owning my dream animal. I have no problem housing a 20 foot long snake...or building an enclosure for one...I have no problem getting my hands on rabbits as my sister breeds them...(what else might I feed a burmese? and how often do they eat?)

My last question is>> are burmese pythons potentially dangerous to human beings as far as taking someone's life? (this is the way kaplan described them)

and how are they for temperment?

Sorry bout the length of this message...thanks.
-----
Chris Vanderwees
REPTILE SALES AND INFORMATION
E-mail Me
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1.2.0 Green Basilisks
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0.0.1 California Kingsnakes
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Replies (12)

cv768 Jan 28, 2004 03:27 PM

Also, I very much realize the unbelievable power and strength these animals have, I am NEVER afriad of the aggressive nature of any animal as long as I am aware of the potential dangers and risks involved.

I would expect with the proper care, treatment, and respect for the animal that they would be relitively safe on some level...

I'm just looking for the opinions of others about the degrees of caution and potential dangerous situations a snake of this size could pose.
-----
Chris Vanderwees
REPTILE SALES AND INFORMATION
E-mail Me
1.3.0 Bearded Dragons
1.2.0 Green Basilisks
1.1.0 Crested Geckos
1.3.0 Veiled Chameleons
1.1.0 Corn Snakes
1.0.0 Tokay Geckos
0.0.1 California Kingsnakes
2.7.0 Leopard Geckos
0.1.0 Green Iguanas
1.1.0 Savannah Monitors

vooptr Jan 28, 2004 07:04 PM

My female is only about 6 months old. But she's as calm as can be and will just sit on your lap for hours. I just got her today yesterday though so there will be some adjustment period i'm sure. She is a beautiful, healthy animal.

rich-k Jan 28, 2004 08:13 PM

A burmese python can be a very dangerous animal if you do not understand its behavior and subsequently put yourself into bad positions. I am not even remotly against people owning them as I have a 4 1/2 ft. ball and a 3 1/2 ft. burmese. They are wondrful creatures to keep and can be very gentle.

I see you mentioned a 20 footer. A 20 footer will easily kill you and probly eat you. My rule is anything over 10 ft you DO NOT handle alone. As the size increases so should the # of handlers at a given time. A 20 footer can still be a gentle animal but if he mistakes you for food one day it could be your last. If a 4 footer gives you a nip cause he mistaked your hand for a rat its no big deal, just stings for a little while.

The trick is to train you snake when to expect food and when not. Sorta like Pavlov's dogs.

Antegy Jan 29, 2004 01:06 PM

Just a couple of things to note here:

I own a burmese python who is now almost exactly ten feet. He's a great pet, though he does, as any burm should, warrant respect at every moment. He is a very friendly, curious snake with endless energy. While I do respect his potential as a relatively untameable animal, I don't fear him. I almost can't imagine how frail or immobilized a person must be to be killed by a ten or eleven foot snake. If my ten footer ever tried to 'kill' me, I would laugh and remind him (quite physically if need be) who the owner is and who the pet is in our relationship. All joking aside, without poison or other 'secret weapons' I can't imagine an animal killing me whose skull I could easily crush in one hand. Now, my friend of six feet-two inches and three hundred pounds - well, he could really do some damage to me. See the difference. Good thing they are both my friends. I know there are some people who met thier fate in the coils of a burm because they were drunk and stupid - but, hey, that one is self-explanatory.

As my snake gets bigger I will continue to be careful and wary of his potential, and having a second person around while handling is definitely a good idea. I won't fear him though, because at that point he would be more of an enemy than a friendly pet. The idea of keeping a caged enemy in my house doesn't sound very appealing to me. What do you think?

One other thing to note: the line connecting Pavlov's dogs and snakes is a very long one. Snakes do not respond nearly as well to conditioning as dogs do. For the most part, snakes do respond to conditioning, but more so on a short term basis, as compared to dogs who can retain conditioning for very long periods of time. This I believe is due to the structure of a snake's brain lending itself more to short term memory vs. long term. That helps to explain why one should be diligent in keeping a pet snake tame with regular handling and safe feeding and handling practices.

Here's a photo of my labyrinth burm (surprisingly cooperative with the camera that day)

Thanks for reading,
- Mark

>>A burmese python can be a very dangerous animal if you do not understand its behavior and subsequently put yourself into bad positions. I am not even remotly against people owning them as I have a 4 1/2 ft. ball and a 3 1/2 ft. burmese. They are wondrful creatures to keep and can be very gentle.
>>
>>I see you mentioned a 20 footer. A 20 footer will easily kill you and probly eat you. My rule is anything over 10 ft you DO NOT handle alone. As the size increases so should the # of handlers at a given time. A 20 footer can still be a gentle animal but if he mistakes you for food one day it could be your last. If a 4 footer gives you a nip cause he mistaked your hand for a rat its no big deal, just stings for a little while.
>>
>>The trick is to train you snake when to expect food and when not. Sorta like Pavlov's dogs.

meretseger Jan 28, 2004 11:08 PM

Burms HAVE killed their owners. It's not a mattter of 'might be possible'. A guy got killed last year in front of a few other people. And some of these burms were only 11 or 12 feet long. Most of the people killed were doing pretty dumb stuff, and accidents are very rare compared to the number of burms out there, but caution is warranted.
I'm glad you read an article that really made you think about buying these animals, they're a BIG responsibility.
(People get crushed to death by vending machines, too, but they have those completely unattended in public places. Go figure.)
-----
"The serpent crams itself with animal life that is often warm and vibrant, to prolong an existence in which we detect no joy and no emotion. It reveals the depth to which evolution can sink when it takes the downward path and strips animals to the irreducible minimum able to perpetuate a predatory life in its naked horror."
Alexander Skutch

Carmichael Jan 29, 2004 02:59 PM

A large burm is quite capable of killing a human; period. So are they life threatening animals? Yes, but do they truly pose a threat to a person's life? No. What I mean is that burmese pythons are by nature fairly placid and easy going animals and it is really how they are raised that will dictate their level of danger (kind of like dogs). But, they demand the utmost in respect and any burm owner must follow some basic absolutes to responsible keeping of large constrictors (i.e. feeding inside their own cage, keeping burm in an escape proof cage that is locked and that cage, in turn, is kept in a locked room, feeding via long tongs, knowing how to use shields, etc.). There are no room for mistakes when working with large burms. I also work with venomous reptiles and the same rules apply. You have to know how to trouble shoot, that is, what to do if your normally tame burm suddently becomes aggressive or agitated. You need to have at least one or two more people around when taking out a large burm. I tell people that a 10' burm is a piece of cake but once that burm reaches 16-18' they are not as much fun. It takes great effort to work with them but it is something I enjoy. Most people just aren't willing to put the time into keeping them properly (and well adjusted for being around people). Personally, as much as I like burms, and enjoy keeping them, I would recommend a smaller species like a borneo, carpet or olive python....nice big snakes but easily managed with one person. Just my .02.

Rob Carmichael, Director/Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center
City of Lake Forest Parks & Recreation (IL)

tango Jan 30, 2004 06:17 AM

Smaller Burmese can give painful bites, but the danger is when they are grown. Their strength is formidable and coupled with their adult size, they can kill an adult man caught off guard. I firmly believe that regular handling and keeping in optimum condition (health, feeding, temps, interaction) will minimize danger to humans. I also believe that not everyone is capable of keeping their Burmese optimally.
BTW, Rob, did you get my e-mails about the rabbits in your area? I e-mailed through this forum twice and didn't receive a reply.
-----
Marcia Pimentel
Tango River Reptiles (Off-line Temporarily)
GiantFeeders

willis1234 Jan 29, 2004 10:01 PM

I have a burm that is around 10 feet now and believe you have to be really comitted to own one. You can not make stupid mistakes like I did when my 10 foot burm thought my hand was his food. Even after I had fed him. Burms, large ones, can kill a person, but can't eat a fully grown human being because of our shoulders. Burms just simply dont get big enough to eat fully grown people, but are capable of eating smaller human beings. As long as you handle your burm often it should become tame, but in every burm I have had I have noticed that at feeding time a burm becomes a different snake that will stirke and try to eat anything that Resembles its food source, like an arm, face, ect. A good thing to have near the cage is a spray bottle full of alchool. That is what I used to get my snake off of me. You just have to spray a little in their mouth or try pulling there tail back or pouring hot water on them.

Gargoyle420 Jan 30, 2004 08:45 AM

A burm is like a loaded gun,it's only dangerous if you under
estimate what it can do or have no respect for it.People have been killed by 10 foot burms.I wouldnt treat a 10 foot burm like a laphound. The guy who thinks he is Hercules and can crush the head of his burm is running downhill with a sharp stick in his hand.I pray he never has one stick to his face and wrap on him.Midwest has a great section on snakebites with pics.Just see what a wussy ten footer can do to flesh...Be safe....Paul.

Antegy Jan 30, 2004 10:27 AM

It does seem absurd to treat a 10 foot burm like it's not a threat. I apologize if that's the impression I gave, and I certainly don't think I'm any kind of Hercules. But one has to admit, a ten foot snake really isn't much of a challenge. More pointedly, they are actually quite delicate, that is, when compared to wrestling with my brother's pitbulls for instance. To tackle a pitbull and throw it on the couch is all fun and play time as far as the dogs are concerned (it's a lot of exercise as far as I'm concerned!). If someone was to tackle a ten foot snake they would very likely cause multiple breaks in its spine, crush its lungs, and almost certainly be the death of it. I don't even like to think about it.

And those photos at Midwest - very graphic indeed, though a good number of the photos are from venomous snakes which are an entirely different ball game altogether. I too have had a few bites: several from smallish two to five footers, one from a twelve foot green anaconda, and another from a nine foot burm. Most all have been firmly planted in my flesh (most notably from the large snakes), though none have left even anything of a scar. Yes, certainly I am lucky, and I know this. And I aim to keep it that way with a diligent wariness and understanding of the animals I handle. I honestly don't want to be that person who runs downhill with a sharp stick in my hand. At least, if I do (which I don't plan on), I want to have a good understanding of that stick and its potential so that I may be prepared to deal with an accidental slip, trip, or fall.

The last bite I got (from the anaconda) was planted firmly enough in my arm that I had to forcibly (without hurting the snake of course) 'peel' the snakes jaws from my arm. As I did a small plucking type sound came as each tooth released. Somewhat painful, yes, and bloody, oh boy yes. But after just a few wipes with a wet paper towel and some alcohol the bleeding stopped completely. I was lucky that we were able to keep the snake from pulling in such a way as to tear my flesh. But that's part of the point here - we were able to address the situation because we aren't oblivious to the dangers these animals may present. Being educated, prepared, and even better - experienced is absolutely necessary to handle such animals. I'm not an expert, no, but I make an honest effort to do the best I can in keeping myself informed and prepared. I hope that doesn't make me sound cocky - it's just the best I think that one can do.

I just want to assure you that I am very careful with my burm. I just don't want people to get the impression that these animals are so dangerous that they should warrant so much fear. I'm more afraid of the gun-toting thugs and gangs downtown than I am of my ten foot burm. But that doesn't mean that I don't still have an understanding and respect for what my snake could potentially do.

Hope this clears things up a little?,
- Mark

>>A burm is like a loaded gun,it's only dangerous if you under
>>estimate what it can do or have no respect for it.People have been killed by 10 foot burms.I wouldnt treat a 10 foot burm like a laphound. The guy who thinks he is Hercules and can crush the head of his burm is running downhill with a sharp stick in his hand.I pray he never has one stick to his face and wrap on him.Midwest has a great section on snakebites with pics.Just see what a wussy ten footer can do to flesh...Be safe....Paul.

BrianSmith Feb 06, 2004 07:46 PM

>>A burm is like a loaded gun,it's only dangerous if you under
>>estimate what it can do or have no respect for it.People have been killed by 10 foot burms.I wouldnt treat a 10 foot burm like a laphound. The guy who thinks he is Hercules and can crush the head of his burm is running downhill with a sharp stick in his hand.I pray he never has one stick to his face and wrap on him.Midwest has a great section on snakebites with pics.Just see what a wussy ten footer can do to flesh...Be safe....Paul.
-----
"If I had 365 enemies it would only take a year out of my life to settle all scores. Heck, much less if some live in the same states as others" Mia Myselfani

"All deeds be they good or bad shall be repaid one hundred fold." Yers Troolie

BrianSmith Feb 03, 2004 05:56 PM

,.... to some extent every activity throughout life is dangerous and potentially life threatening. But that fact almost never enters one's mind throughout life and as we go through every day activities that have some level of potential life-threatening risk. And it most certainly never stops us from doing what we want to do and enjoying life to its fullest.

What I mean is this: I personally think that keeping burmese in a responsible, semi-professional or professional manner is FAR less dangerous than even driving our cars to the store to pick up a gallon of milk (odds-wise). So why dwell on the "possible danger"? If that is the case perhaps we should ban cars, horses, roller skates, ice cream bars, and everything else that can possibly cause death (which is everything). Where does the concern for safety end? If based on the "possible factor" we shouldn't own large pythons because they could kill us,... then we should all file into individual, sealed, plastic boxes and be tube fed for life to avoid all the other risks in this world.

No,.. I say have your burmese, your fast cars, your roller skates,.... but own them responsibly and cut the risks down as much as is humanly possible. To accept less is to not be the highly evolved humanoids that we have come to be.

>>Alright, seeing as I'm in a city with a dumbass bylaw banning the keeping of all boas and pythons...yup I said ALL...I won't be able to own any of them anytime soon without a minimal risk of a large fine and confiscation of the animal.
>>
>>However, we will be moving outside of city limits someday within the next year or two and I am going to get my hands on burmese and ball pythons...we've kept every colubrid possible and absolutely love keeping and breeding snakes...
>>
>>Now, I don't mind if a snake is overly aggressive (biting, deficating, hissing) but I read Melissa Kaplan's article on Burmese pythons and she almost discouraged me from owning my dream animal. I have no problem housing a 20 foot long snake...or building an enclosure for one...I have no problem getting my hands on rabbits as my sister breeds them...(what else might I feed a burmese? and how often do they eat?)
>>
>>My last question is>> are burmese pythons potentially dangerous to human beings as far as taking someone's life? (this is the way kaplan described them)
>>
>>and how are they for temperment?
>>
>>Sorry bout the length of this message...thanks.
>>-----
>>Chris Vanderwees
>>REPTILE SALES AND INFORMATION
>>E-mail Me
>>1.3.0 Bearded Dragons
>>1.2.0 Green Basilisks
>>1.1.0 Crested Geckos
>>1.3.0 Veiled Chameleons
>>1.1.0 Corn Snakes
>>1.0.0 Tokay Geckos
>>0.0.1 California Kingsnakes
>>2.7.0 Leopard Geckos
>>0.1.0 Green Iguanas
>>1.1.0 Savannah Monitors
-----
"If I had 365 enemies it would only take a year out of my life to settle all scores. Heck, much less if some live in the same states as others" Mia Myselfani

"All deeds be they good or bad shall be repaid one hundred fold." Yers Troolie

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