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A Question of Ethics

Cyclura Feb 07, 2004 09:28 PM

I am looking for some advice from fellow herper’s and breeders.

Currently I work for a reptile breeder with whom I have noticed quite a few unethical business practices…. in general, with the customers he deals with, and the way in which his animals are treated.

In a nutshell, this breeder (who has been around for a while); quite often mis-represents the hybrids he sells; lies to the customer(s) in order to make a sale, and rarely honors any type of warranty when it comes to his animals.

Many times, when his animals are sick, he will not seek advice as to the problem, but conducts what I call “Frankenstein Medicine”…using whatever medication is at his disposal to “treat” the infected/sick animal. NEVER will he disclose to a customer if an animal he sells has been medicated (moreso because he isn’t sure what it is it was treated for).

I have personally witnessed this breeder having harsh words when a customer calls to complain about an animal, which always results in his hanging up on them, and then telling the staff that if this customer calls back to tell them he isn’t available.

Among other things, here are what other staff members and I have noticed with this breeder:

• Selling other peoples’ stock as his own
• Selling Boa’s with respiratory infections; and then telling the customer that their warranty has expired when they complain. (His warranty is good for 48 hours only).
• Refusing to refund customers in the case of late deliveries…. although they paid for a specific service.
• Mis-representing the Hybrids he sells…if it looks like a Pyro, he sells it as a Pyro, etc.
• Selling wild-caught animals as either CB or stating that they have been treated (neither being the case).
• Urging customers NOT to take their snakes to a local (and well-respected) reptile vet; rather they let him “treat” it.
• If an animal he is “treating” dies, he will not refund any monies to the customer….but offers a 50% discount if they purchase another.
• Feeding many of his omnivorous & herbivorous reptile’s food items that he “fishes” out of a local supermarket trash pile. We have had to wash coffee grounds, cigarette butts, tissue paper, rotting food, etc. from the greens before they can be used to feed animals.
• Not providing heat sources for many of his desert-dwelling lizards. “It costs too much” is his reply.
• Does not allow staff members to clean display cages (bedding) between animals….as soon as one sells, he places another in the same cage (although the water bowl is changed out).
• Sells “donated” animals without quarantine periods….in today, gone tomorrow; and represents the animals as having been at the shop for quite sometime.
• Telling customers who talk to staff members for too long of a period that they are “Wasting his employees’ time”. Regardless if they are asking questions about care, husbandry, etc.

The truly sad part of all this is that the owner is quite knowledgeable in reptilian care and husbandry, as well as breeding. Unfortunately, his quest for a buck blinds him to the quality of care that these animals deserve; and not being fair to the customers.

My quandary is this:

This particular breeder has been around for quite some time (although his ethics, or lack thereof, are known by many other breeders); and he is my boss.

Although he is my boss, I also feel compelled to inform others about this person and his lack of ethics. Would doing so expose me to a “slander” lawsuit, even though ALL staff members agree on this mans business practices and can confirm the above statements?
How would doing so affect my future in the reptile industry as a breeder myself?

Any feedback on how to handle this situation greatly appreciated.

Replies (5)

rodmalm Feb 08, 2004 12:00 AM

Just my opinion, but..

I don't mind these two "gripes" too much.

• Urging customers NOT to take their snakes to a local (and well-respected) reptile vet; rather they let him “treat” it.
• If an animal he is “treating” dies, he will not refund any monies to the customer….but offers a 50% discount if they purchase another.

Though the top one is questionable. It's more a question of survival rates between his treatments and the vets. in my opinion. The bottom one is basically just a business decision and up to him. It appears he is just trying to recoup his costs of purchasing the animal, while not loosing the sale. Basically selling the second animal at around cost, and trying to still keep the customer happy.

Everything else you stated is terrible.

As for slander, I'd ask that question on the legal/herp law forum. But my understanding is that it is only slander if what you are saying is false.--Basically the definition of slander. If he charges you, and you can prove what you are saying is true in a court of law, then you should be fine.

As for your reputation if you expose him, I would think it would improve it!--It would in my book anyway.

Assuming he doesn't then slander you, and the claims he then makes, stick in the eyes of the public. This is a good possibility if he is well known and respected by others, while you are not well known by the public.

You'll have to weigh these things and decide what to do, but if you expose him, I would keep a record of everything you say/print, dates said, etc.. Just in case it comes to the point that you need that info. in a courtroom, it could be very helpful in proving your case.

Rodney

pulatus Feb 08, 2004 08:43 PM

Do you know about the Board of Inquiry? Do a search for Fauna Classifieds and consider posting to the BOI. Wait - I'll find it for you.....

Here it is:

http://www.[bleep].com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=13

People like your boss need to be exposed. Give him hell!

Joe

BILLY Feb 09, 2004 03:03 AM

This guy seems like a real piece of work. He definetely needs to be exposed. If you have evidence AND the testimony of other employees, then you have nothing to worry about.

Guys like this need to be shown for what they are and taken out of our hobby/business. There is no excuse for this pathetic way to practice business. If what you say is true, then you would be doing the right thing to let as many people as possible know about him by exposing him. You know what to do brutha!!!

Take care!
Billy
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Genesis 1:1

kick_baal Feb 09, 2004 09:39 PM

Document everything and be specific - dates & events!!! Never rely on anyone's word or assistance to back you up. Let your records do the talking. I use a calendar for these things and it saved ass when a sleazebag store owner here in Atlanta tried to cheat me out of my final paycheck. He thought I would be unable to prove I worked that week because there wasn't a time clock, but I showed the judge my dayplanner where I logged a consistent daily record of the hours I worked. Voila, I got my last check to the penny, plus the $50 filing fee for Small Claims Court.
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Who is like Set...

1.1 Vietnamese Blue Beauties
2.0 Taiwan Beauties
2.3 Cave Beauties
0.1 Bull Snake
1.0.0 Argentine Blk & Wht Tegu
2.5 Box Turtles

rearfang Feb 10, 2004 06:10 PM

Check the Board of inquiry mentioned. As far as legal action goes, you need to document transactions, fatalities and where ever possible tie them in with the customers and/or employees involved. They will probably need to testify or at least be deposed if it isn't settled out of court. Your best bet is to file a report of animal abuse so the authorities can walk in and get their own evidence.

Slander is ANY statement alleged to be fact, that has been spoken, written or taped that is derogatory to the party refered to...UNLESS PROOF IS PRESENTED TO VERIFY IT. Or to put it simply: You can say a person sucks, but if you say he sucks because he is a thief, abuser (or whatever)you better have proof or your butt will be in the sling. Courts can be amazingly thickheaded when it comes to that point.

I wish I could say your boss is an isoloated case, but unfortunatly...I know at least three Dealer/breeders that fit your discription. The Devil in this is the proving what everybody knows.

Good Luck, Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

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