Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I know this is going to sound insane, but I've had a gravid female finally lay her eggs after 5 months. While I was vending at the IRBA San Mateo, CA show last September, I traded with another breeder for a beautiful 16 month old patternless female, that was definately gravid. Weeks went by, and she showed no signs of being ready to lay. By Thanksgiving, I was out of my mind with worry, but she was eating like a pig and actually growing! I called my vet, and he didn't seem to be the least concerned... he told me she would probably lay them the next time she ovulated.

Well, after her 90-day quarantine, I put her in with my patternless breeding colony around Christmas time, and she did very well up until 2 days ago when she quit eating. This afternoon, I took her out of the colony and put her in her own private enclosure with a Cool-Whip container with moist vermiculite. I just checked, and she laid 2 (infertile) eggs!!!

I have NEVER heard of anything like this, and I have been so stressed out about it! She is just fine... drank a whole bunch of water and powered down 6 crickets.

-----
Marcia McGuiness
Golden Gate Geckos
www.goldengategeckos.com

. . . holy cow Marcia - what were they - the size of ping-pong balls? I wonder why it took so long.

It would have driven me nuts. My original leo always takes about 6 weeks, it seems to get the first one out. I'm pacing like a 1st time dad . . .
-----
Monte Meyer
Powergeckos
Email

No Fru-Fru morphs in the herp room

That sure is a strange story. This is just an honest guess, as always, but I think she might of had abnormally large egg follicles that looked like eggs.

I have just recently begun to research and try to learn about leopard gecko ovulation. I doubt many rookie breeders understand much about the process, and it would be good to discuss this.

It is my understanding that females begin to develop egg follicles, which appear like small eggs, before they are receptive to breeding. Once they have sperm to fertilize the developing egg they finish the egg making process, and deposit the eggs. Otherwise the ‘unprocessed’ eggs will re-absorb into the females body. Is this similar to your understanding of ovulation in leos? If I am way off track please correct me.

DaveCable

... but, these were unmistakedly eggs. They were approximately 2.5 - 3 centimeters long, and visible through her abdomen from her rib cage all the way down to just above the front of her pelvis. I would have expected them to be reabsorbed long ago! I checked her again just a little while ago using a pen light, and she does have two very large follicles (surrounded with pink/red tissue) forming right now. Go figure!
-----
Marcia McGuiness
Golden Gate Geckos
www.goldengategeckos.com

Yes, that sure makes this an interesting case. I forgot to mention in my original post, that females can also lay infertile eggs in the absence of a male. Do you or anyone else have any insight into what might trigger a female to lay eggs, fertile or infertile?

I don’t doubt your judgment, but I was wondering how you determined that her eggs were infertile. I got the impression that they were laid recently, and I’ve noticed that it is sometimes hard to tell within the first few weeks if the eggs are fertile. Thanks for you input, I have think this is a very interesting subject.

Females can and do produce eggs without being exposed to a male. They are infertile, of course... and the breeder I got this female from told me she had not been bred. I can usually tell within a few hours if eggs are fertile. Infertile eggs are usually very soft, thin-shelled, and have the consistency of a water balloon. Fertile eggs will firm up to a chalky, leathery consistency fairly quickly. I do incubate all of them though, and the infertile ones will usually fail within the first 3-5 days.
-----
Marcia McGuiness
Golden Gate Geckos
www.goldengategeckos.com

Yep I have noticed what you described about the eggs. Most of the eggs with a thin wall fail very fast, and end up collapsing or molding over. I too continue to incubate them, just incase.

I guess what I’m trying to understand is how the eggs develop the desired leathery shell. Is it because the mother ‘treats’ them with sperm or hormones? Do the embryos or egg release their own hormones within a few hours of being laid, causing the shell to harden?

Thanks again for all your insight, and for putting up with all my questions.

I don't know why the shells on fertile eggs differ from infertile eggs. This is a great question, so I hope somone has an answer!
-----
Marcia McGuiness
Golden Gate Geckos
www.goldengategeckos.com

Contrary to the common misconception, eggs are not reabsorbed. It is the infertile folicles that merely shrink back up that appears to be egg reabsorbtion. That's also why "infertile eggs" that are layed do not harden off. If an egg does form in the female it must be laid or else it will cause egg binding.
-----
Rick-Geckoland USA

I know someone who had a gecko go 7 months and finally laid..lol.
Its crazy, but I guess it happens.
Congrats btw, glad she's ok
-----
Crystal Light (Yes..thats my real name)

*Whenever you lose a gecko, just think of it as God building on his own Leopard Gecko collection

www.thegeckobarn.com