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Just wondering if anyone has used goliath hornworms as feeders yet, and how your animals took to them.

>>Just wondering if anyone has used goliath hornworms as feeders yet, and how your animals took to them.

Just did a search, and there are plenty of hornworm posts, but nobody has really had much success rasing them.

I have heard they work fine. Just make sure you either use tongs to hold the head while feeding or pinch the mouthparts off as I hear they have a good bite to 'em. Andy
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Andy Maddox
AIM: SurfAndSkimTx04
MSN: Poloboy32486@hotmail.com
Yahoo:surfandskimtx04
Houston Herp Key
The Reptizone

Burgundy baby, With your blue eyed soul, You play the hits and I'm on that roll, Capricorn sister, Freddie Mercury, Jupiter Child cry

I've fed them to my horned frog, box turtle and my veiled chameleon. My horned frog had no problem with them and my box turtle had a lot of fun. My veiled chameleon was very hesitant to try it at first but eventually took a small one. They seem to be a good way to add variety to a large frogs diet. Good luck,
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Devin
devin@amphibiancare.com
www.amphibiancare.com
4.1 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Dwarf French Guiana'
1.1 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Powder Blue'
5.1 Mantella aurantiaca
2.1 Mantella crocea
0.0.2 Mantella madagascariensis
1.0 Ceratophrys cranwelli
1.0 Bufo americanus
0.0.1 Salamandra salamandra
1.0 Ambystoma tigrinum
0.1 Chamaeleo calyptratus
0.1 Phelsuma dubia
1.0 Uroplatus ebenaui
0.0.1 Chrysemys picta belli
1.0 Terrapene carolina triunguis

>>Just wondering if anyone has used goliath hornworms as feeders yet, and how your animals took to them.
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Rob Talkington

Hi Rob,

Silkworms are great. They are smaller than horn worms so most good sized amphibians can easily handle them. I've fed them to my salamanders, horned frog, box turtle, painted turtle and veiled chameleon although I'm sure that most insectivorius species would accept them. Another good way to a vary a herps diet,
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Devin
devin@amphibiancare.com
www.amphibiancare.com
4.1 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Dwarf French Guiana'
1.1 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Powder Blue'
5.1 Mantella aurantiaca
2.1 Mantella crocea
0.0.2 Mantella madagascariensis
1.0 Ceratophrys cranwelli
1.0 Bufo americanus
0.0.1 Salamandra salamandra
1.0 Ambystoma tigrinum
0.1 Chamaeleo calyptratus
0.1 Phelsuma dubia
1.0 Uroplatus ebenaui
0.0.1 Chrysemys picta belli
1.0 Terrapene carolina triunguis

Hey Devin,

Thanks for the info. I've got a couple bearded dragons and crix had always thought of being the staple insect but not too long ago it was determined silkies were more nutritious and lower in fat than crix and a very, very good staple. I wonder if they would be a good staple replacement and not just as a side dish?

What do you think? Has anybody ever thought of replacing their regular feedings of crix with silkies and only used the crix as a side dish? I mean, why crix? What's the nutrient(s) in them that makes them the best staple for froggies?

Thanks a bunch for your help.

BTW, I'm only looking into getting a pacman right now so I'm new to amphibians. I can't hardly wait, though!!
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Rob Talkington

One thing I do know is that both hornworms and silkworms are expensive, and unless you have access to a mulberry bush or two that's pesticide free, you're pretty much stuck with buying the premade chow from Mulberry farms (or other places). Same thing with hornworms. I just purchased a small cup of hornworms and I'll see how it goes.

>>Hey Devin,
>>
>>Thanks for the info. I've got a couple bearded dragons and crix had always thought of being the staple insect but not too long ago it was determined silkies were more nutritious and lower in fat than crix and a very, very good staple. I wonder if they would be a good staple replacement and not just as a side dish?
>>
>>What do you think? Has anybody ever thought of replacing their regular feedings of crix with silkies and only used the crix as a side dish? I mean, why crix? What's the nutrient(s) in them that makes them the best staple for froggies?
>>
>>Thanks a bunch for your help.
>>
>>BTW, I'm only looking into getting a pacman right now so I'm new to amphibians. I can't hardly wait, though!!
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>>Rob Talkington

I've been raising silkies for about 6 mos now and as long as you keep them small the chow goes a long way. My experience with the horn worms is that they suck ! I'll elaborate, I've gotten 3 cups from MF.com and with all three cups all the worms ended up either getting crushed from chow falling out of that web mesh or the worms just died w/out any explanation. I take that back, I had about 3 worms that grew bigger than an inch out of the 3 cups.

FYI, the cool thing about silkies is once you have a pair of moths the female lays 200-500 eggs so it only takes a few breeding pairs to get a lot of stock.

Other than all that though, do you think they would make good replacements for crix? FYI, I really, really don't like crix. I'll do what has to be done, no problem, but if I can use silkies I'd rather do that.
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Rob Talkington

Well why didn't you mention that you've raised silkworms before in your post!? Anyway, I haven't tried either yet, and the hornworms are my first shot, so like I said I'll see how it goes. I didn't order my hornies from MF so hopefully I have a better experience with them.

I've been under the impression that the chow goes fast. That's what all the sites pretty much say anyway. Maybe it's different with silkies since they don't get as big. Hornies might be a different story.

I've heard that silkies are a lot better than crickets, so I don't see a problem with using them as a staple, and if you've been having success with raising them, more power to ya. Of course I'm no expert so I could be talking out my butt. I hate crickets as well. They stink, they chirp, they drown, they die. Awful things. That's why I'm always on the lookout for a different staple.

I would love to know your setup and what you've done to keep your silkies going...

>>I've been raising silkies for about 6 mos now and as long as you keep them small the chow goes a long way. My experience with the horn worms is that they suck ! I'll elaborate, I've gotten 3 cups from MF.com and with all three cups all the worms ended up either getting crushed from chow falling out of that web mesh or the worms just died w/out any explanation. I take that back, I had about 3 worms that grew bigger than an inch out of the 3 cups.
>>
>>FYI, the cool thing about silkies is once you have a pair of moths the female lays 200-500 eggs so it only takes a few breeding pairs to get a lot of stock.
>>
>>Other than all that though, do you think they would make good replacements for crix? FYI, I really, really don't like crix. I'll do what has to be done, no problem, but if I can use silkies I'd rather do that.
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>>Rob Talkington

Well, here's a few things about my setup.

I keep them in rubbermaid containers that have been scuffed with sandpaper to give the worms grip. This keeps them from clumping in a big matted pile of silk.

The temps are anywhere from 68-85 degrees depending on how fast I want them to grow. Warmer=faster growth.

I feed most of them once a day. Feeding consists of either chunks of the chow or gratings depending on how big the worms are. If they are small (1/2" or smaller) I grate the chow. If I have 10 or so set aside to cocoon and am planning on breeding them I give them a constant supply of food after they reach about 2.5"-3".

When they cocoon I cut toilet paper rolls in half and put them together with paperclips, like a pyramid. In 3 days they will be done spinning and I consolidate the cocoons into a gladware container.

In about a week they will emerge from the cocoons and when I find a male and female I seperate them into their own container. In 2-5 days the female will lay 200-500 eggs. If the eggs are fertile they will turn dark within a few days. Once that happens I either place the eggs in the incubator at 84 degrees or put the eggs in a plastic baggie in the fridge for up to 5 years.

The moths don't eat, drink or fly. The only thing they do is mate. The only thing I think is messy about the breeding is the moths will sometimes squirt some sort of liquid that you have to watch out for. They only do it once or twice, though.

That's my basic setup.
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Rob Talkington

Sounds easy enough. What exactly are the toilet paper rolls for? And how many worms do you keep in one rubbermaid? Have you tried heating the eggs without an incubator, and did it work? Thanks for the info...

>>Well, here's a few things about my setup.
>>
>>I keep them in rubbermaid containers that have been scuffed with sandpaper to give the worms grip. This keeps them from clumping in a big matted pile of silk.
>>
>>The temps are anywhere from 68-85 degrees depending on how fast I want them to grow. Warmer=faster growth.
>>
>>I feed most of them once a day. Feeding consists of either chunks of the chow or gratings depending on how big the worms are. If they are small (1/2" or smaller) I grate the chow. If I have 10 or so set aside to cocoon and am planning on breeding them I give them a constant supply of food after they reach about 2.5"-3".
>>
>>When they cocoon I cut toilet paper rolls in half and put them together with paperclips, like a pyramid. In 3 days they will be done spinning and I consolidate the cocoons into a gladware container.
>>
>>In about a week they will emerge from the cocoons and when I find a male and female I seperate them into their own container. In 2-5 days the female will lay 200-500 eggs. If the eggs are fertile they will turn dark within a few days. Once that happens I either place the eggs in the incubator at 84 degrees or put the eggs in a plastic baggie in the fridge for up to 5 years.
>>
>>The moths don't eat, drink or fly. The only thing they do is mate. The only thing I think is messy about the breeding is the moths will sometimes squirt some sort of liquid that you have to watch out for. They only do it once or twice, though.
>>
>>That's my basic setup.
>>-----
>>Rob Talkington

>>Sounds easy enough. What exactly are the toilet paper rolls for? And how many worms do you keep in one rubbermaid? Have you tried heating the eggs without an incubator, and did it work? Thanks for the info...

"What exactly are the toilet paper rolls for?"

They are to give the worms something to spin their cocoons in.

"And how many worms do you keep in one rubbermaid?"

Depends on the size of the rubbermaid. I couldn't give you an exact count but just make sure they aren't right on top of each other. A pic of one of my tubs is below.

"Have you tried heating the eggs without an incubator, and did it work?"

I haven't tried personally but I think others have. It probably depends to a certain extent on the amount of heat they are kept at. They also must stay humid, which I didn't mention in my previous post. One way MF.com says to do this is to place the eggs under a bowl with one side propped up and a damp papertowel. I'm assuming it would work but, no I haven't tried it.

Glad to help!
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Rob Talkington

Silkies.

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Rob Talkington

Dang! That's awesome. So you just place the chow in dishes? Do their droppings tend to stink? Is there any smell to them at all? Thanks! (just changed my username; was ericthemantis)

You don't have to place the chow in dishes. The only reason those petri dishes are in there is because that's what the worms started out in. They were eggs in the dishes and stayed in there for a long time so I just let be.

The only smell I've ever had from them is when I make the chow. It smells like mulberry leaves or when they are really small and have been in the incubator, in the petri dish eating for a week. After the lid comes and everything dries that smell is gone. I don't worry about the droppings for a good two - three weeks depending on how quickly they grow. When they get 2.5-3" I usually move them into a new, clean container.

Here's a pic of some petri dishes incubating.

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Rob Talkington