Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hello. My family and I share our home with a juvenile ball python and a recently acquired adult ball that was surrendered at the vet clinic where I work. Both have been feeding on live prey. Since buying the juvenile about a month ago, I have been trying to switch him from live prey to f/t with no luck whatsover. At first he would strike, coil and then release...paying no attention whatsoever after the initial strike. I have tried warming the enclosure, feeding at night, putting him in a paperbag with the prey item, mouse maker, and dangling the poor dead critter in front of the snake until my arm felt like it was going to fall off. Nothing has worked. Many care sheets mention leaving the prey item in with the snake overnight....my question is how long is it safe to leave a dead animal in with my snakes??? Sorry but I just wonder how safe that can be and how quickly it will get "ripe". Sorry for the ignorant question!!

Another question is this...several items I have read also mention dangling the prey item outside of the snake's hide? Does this mean many of you feed in the snake's enclosure?? I have been feeding in a separate container with no hide...just an enclosed spot free from disturbances. Should I try feeding in the habitat?? What about the feeding response and striking when I go in to take him out for handling??

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!! Thank you!

Christiane

There's no harm in leaving a prekilled prey item in the enclosure overnight. Just put it in right after lights out, and take it out in the morning. Also I see no benefit in feeding a ball python in a different enclosure, they're shy, secretive animals and that unnecessary stress isn't going to entice a feeding responce. Hope this helps.

-Dennis

Yeah, I just don't get the theory that feeding in the enclosure will condition them to associate you with food. I mean, you go in the cage for other reasons - cleaning, handling, etc. I feed in the enclosure no problem.

However, if you feed on a lose substrate you should feed outside the enclosure to be safe. Or if you're just having problems with them eating (and you're absolutely positive it's not due to improper conditions, shedding, normal going off-feed, etc) you might give it a shot.
-----
Check Out My Albums

1.0 Ball Python
"Aragorn"

1.0 Kenyan Sand Boa
"Gimli"

0.1 Australian Cattle Dog/Pointer
"Kira"

Actually the potential risk of ingested substrate causing impaction in reptiles is highly exagerated. I have spoken to or e-mailed many hobbyists and breeders on this subject and most feed in the cage on loose substrate and have done so for years without issue. I also have spoken on several occasions with my areas most prominent reptile veterenarian, and he stated that he has never seen one legitimate case of impaction of ingested substrate in a reptile. I'm not saying that it never happens, but it's not nearly as common as you might think.

-Dennis

Not always... I've killed a number of hatchling corn snakes by feeding on loose substrate. I now keep all of my hatchlings on paper towels or newspaper. In fact I keep all of my snakes on newspaper except for my adult ball pythons which I keep on cypress mulch because of it's moisture retaining ability. I still feed them in their cages, but I put a half sheet of newspaper down on top of the mulch and put the rat on top of that on feeding day. Seems to work ok for me. Next thing you know they'll be wanting to be fed off of silver platters.. fussy little beasts...

Mark

>>Actually the potential risk of ingested substrate causing impaction in reptiles is highly exagerated. I have spoken to or e-mailed many hobbyists and breeders on this subject and most feed in the cage on loose substrate and have done so for years without issue. I also have spoken on several occasions with my areas most prominent reptile veterenarian, and he stated that he has never seen one legitimate case of impaction of ingested substrate in a reptile. I'm not saying that it never happens, but it's not nearly as common as you might think.
>>
>>-Dennis

I can see my BP getting to the "silver platter" stage. He's something already. After thawing his food, not only do I have to warm it up, but he won't touch it unless it's 108 degrees or higher on the outside. It's true, I've tested it many times. He won't take it off the tongs though. I warm it up, wiggle a bit in front of him, when he's attentive I let it go and when it hits the ground he strikes. I'm working on a new set of experiments now - it seems that he will strike the food directly from the tongs if the prey is 114 degrees or higher.

Silver platter, grey poupon, glass of wine....I can see it now.
-----
Check Out My Albums

1.0 Ball Python
"Aragorn"

1.0 Kenyan Sand Boa
"Gimli"

0.1 Australian Cattle Dog/Pointer
"Kira"

I'm not saying it never happens, but how do you know your cornsnake deaths were directly related to ingested substrate?

-Dennis

Because after they died. I cut them open and found their lower intestines completely packed with the substrate, the intestines looked like stuffed sausages they were so full.

Mark

>>I'm not saying it never happens, but how do you know your cornsnake deaths were directly related to ingested substrate?
>>
>>-Dennis

Yeah, I've heard of a lot of breeders and other keepers who feed on it too. I'm just too chicken to try!
-----
Check Out My Albums

1.0 Ball Python
"Aragorn"

1.0 Kenyan Sand Boa
"Gimli"

0.1 Australian Cattle Dog/Pointer
"Kira"

Leaving dead prey in the inclosure overnight is fine. Many snakes will eat carrion in the wild, I've had some snakes that I couldn't get started feeding until their food was nicely ripe. Just don't leave the prey item over the heat source or it could drive YOU out of the house (won't bother the snake any). I also feed all of my snakes in their home enclosures rather then using a feeding box and have been doing it for years. Personally I think that idea of feeding in a seperate enclosure is an old wives tale. It 'sounds' like it would make sense, but I've never noticed that it made any difference in a snakes temperament. It could actually be detrimental when getting a stubborn feeder to feed. Taking an already shy animal out of it's familiar surroundings in order to feed it doesn't make sense to me.

Mark

Thank you everyone!! I left a f/t mouse in with both bps lastnight...the older one had eaten when I checked this morning!! The younger was just curled next to the food. Soo...I will wait a few more days and try again with the younger snake. I had put them in bags within their enclosures (my corn snakes were "bag" trained (or so I was told) and only seem to want to eat when inside the paper bag. I intend to feed in the enclosures from now on for the bps. The people that surrendered the older ball brought a small rat for it to eat. Now my daughter is attached to the rat . EESH Which is worse? To be fed to a snake or to be packed around all day by an eight year old? LOL!

Thank you for all the tips!! I will keep trying to switch the younger to f/t and the new info will help tremendously!!

1:0 ball python "Noah"
1:0 ball python "Darwin"
0:0:1 anery corn "Stitch"
0:0:1 snow corn "Lilo"
2 bloodhounds (Ramblin' Emma Rose and Beauregard)
2 yorkshire terriers (Lady Loo and R Star Mira)
1 German Shepherd (Contessa)
3 mix breed foster dogs (Rufus, Sebastian and Brewster)
6 cats (Calico Claws, Tigger, Magdylyn, Madeline, Molly, Domino)
1 sugar glider (Jasper)
2 rats (Arwyn,and un-named male rat that was supposed to be food)
1 parakeet (Milo)
2 fish (un-named)
1 rabbit (Star)

It is a zoo around here!!