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Att: Nankie - Things to do before going to the vet:

Brian-SFCRC Feb 25, 2004 04:15 AM

LEEWAY CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (LCRC)

Hello,

I wish you well on your ill Corucia. To be prepared, try to do the following:

1). If you don't do so keep documented records on physical and
behavior observations.
2). Check fecal samples bring one along to the Vet. Is it
smelly and watery? Is it an unusual color? A normal
Corucia turd is brown/black-looks like a pretzel nugget-and
has a 'smokey' smell.
3). Check the inside of her/his mouth. Any whitish or raised
areas? Unusual color? Excessive red? discoloration of
the gums, etc.
4). Check weight. This is important for any medical dosages
given.
5). Check skin any signs of 'Moon Cratering'? This is indicative
of a Psuedomonas infection. Apply neosporin over entire
skin. eliminate stagnant air. Air should be humid-but with
sufficient air flow.
6). Look at spinal column. Is it raised and pronounced?
7). Tresplod sign. Look at hip area where the spinal column
meets the hip bones. Are they raised and noticeable?
8). Signs of incomplete or an irregular shed.
9). Give Pothos leaves to eat. Pothos will make the urine
appear brown instead of clear. With this, one can tell the
duration of a bowel movement from a specific time of
feeding.
10).Note strength. Does your Corucia exhibit a strong grasp
with her/his claws and tail when picked up?

The thing that worries me the most is that you mentioned the eyes sunken in. Get to the vet and please let us know of the results. Our hopes and hearts are with you!

Sincerely,
Brian
LCRC

Replies (15)

zeteki Feb 25, 2004 11:47 AM

Tresplod hip sign?

I know the phenomenon that you are refering to, but I've never heard this word "tresplod" before.

I've looked, but I can't find it in my medical or veterinary books, what does it mean?

-Z

Brian-SFCRC Feb 26, 2004 12:51 PM

LEEWAY CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (LCRC)

Hello "Z",

Hope your doing well.

Tresplod (3 Beamed) Sign: The raised bone of the spinal column and 2 hip bones.

Refer to: Several former Kingsnake Skink Forum posts, also published article: "Distress Signals of Reptiles" - Stivers? Dahl Publications.

Sincerely,
Brian
LCRC

zeteki Feb 27, 2004 12:19 AM

Hi Brian.

Thanks, I am doing well.

Thanks also for the reference. Unfortunately neither the university library nor google turned up "distress signals of reptiles" or Dahl publications. I did find a heap of articles by a James Stivers, but nothing to do with reptiles.

Like I said though, I'm familiar with the symptom, but had never before heard that word.

Ah well, such is life.

-Z

Brian-SFCRC Feb 27, 2004 08:27 AM

LEEWAY CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (LCRC)

Hi Z,

I unfortunately had much material of mine tossed about a year ago. That article was most likely amoung the casualties. If I can find more info on this, I will be glad to share it with you.

It would be a pain I know but (And I know in the Skink archives after a certain time-the cut-off being about May of 2003, all earlier posts are deleted) you could go back and search for earlier posts on this subject.

Sincerely,
Brian
LCRC

bob_the_snowman Feb 26, 2004 12:13 PM

Hello..I was just wondering if you could explain to me what "Tresplod Hip Sign" is and the risk that it is to PTS
How do you treat it?

JeanP. Feb 26, 2004 12:38 PM

Hi Snowman,

It refers to the bones in the hip area being very prominent in a sick Monkey skink and thus a tell-tail sign of undernurishment.
As to what to do. yes! something immediately. It depends. The skink may need just proper nourishment. The individual
may suffer from a Viral, Bacterial, fungal, protozoan, or vermicular infection or a combination thereof.

Best Regards,
Jean

Brian-SFCRC Feb 26, 2004 12:55 PM

.

JeanP. Feb 26, 2004 10:32 PM

np

bob_the_snowman Feb 26, 2004 03:11 PM

Hey Jean
Thanks for the quick reply! Anyways, we had gotten a fecal done on Rocko about a month or more back and it came up clear. We've been having a trouble keeping her weight on but we do feed her everday and she usually does eat, sometimes it just takes a while to get her interested in her food. We feed her squash, mango, sweet potatoe, zucchini, cucumber and shes not very fond of greens. We also feed her creamed corn baby food and peas baby food when she won't eat. Is there something we are doing wrong?
We also give her calcium
Thanks

JeanP. Feb 26, 2004 07:20 PM

Hi Snowman,***

Watch the mango, offer greens (not spinach) more. Definately, Pothos. Eliminate the Creamed corn. Cream and butter are good for mammals not reptiles). Regular corn is fine although corn is not always digested properly.

Best of Luck.

Jean

zeteki Feb 27, 2004 12:39 AM

Hi Jean.

I've been thinking lately about the "spinach ban". The problem with Spinach (and rhubarb, squash, sweet potato, peas, swiss chard...) is that it's high in oxalates. Oxalates occur naturally in many plants and bind with important nutrients like Calcium once ingested. This makes those nutrient less bio-available to the organism. For most herbivores, like Iguanas and Uromastyx, this is a big problem when foods high in oxalates are fed in large quantities. Smaller quantities really aren't much of a problem.

However, Corucia eat lots of Pothos in the wild and Pothos is very high in oxalates. In fact, it is commonly listed as a toxic plant for most herps because of it's oxalate content.

It would seem to me that Corucia must have some mechanism to deal with this and should be less likely to suffer from eating other foods high in oxalates.

I'm definitely not saying that we should all go switch our Corucia to an all-spinach diet, but I think the risks of offering foods high in oxalates is much lower for Corucia than for other herps. I do include spinach, on occasion, in my salad mixes.

Of course, this is just me theorizing. Take it or leave it.

-Z

Brian-SFCRC Feb 27, 2004 07:56 AM

.

JeanP. Feb 27, 2004 08:07 AM

Hi Z,

As Brian said, excellent observation but as valuable as Corucia are, I would tend to be overly cautious until the finding was etched in stone. They probably can handle the oxalates but I would Recommend keeping the spinach low and infrequent until we know more. Thank you so much for mentioning this.

Best regards,
Jean

zeteki Feb 27, 2004 12:45 AM

You may want to take a good look at your husbandry (temps, humidity, etc). I find that most feeding problems can be solved by fixing something as simple as ambient temps or photperiod.

Another thing you might try is to leave the greens in large-ish chunks (an inch or two square) and chop up the "goodies" really
fine. Once everything is mixed together the skink will end up eating the greens to get to the good stuff. Keep in mind though that fruits should only be about 5% of the diet.

Someone else here (sorry, can't remember who) also sprinkles a bit of fruit juice on the greens to make them more appealing.

-Z

nankie Feb 27, 2004 02:28 PM

Thank you - I will try those suggestions.

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