Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This time of year stinks! There is not much for sale quite yet and those that are selling seem to have 'sales/deals pending'. It can be so frustrating waiting for others to make up their minds or deliver funds with a purchase.

How long do you guys wait for a customer before you release a 'hold' on an animal? Just about EVERY single breeder I have contacted over the past few weeks were holding snakes for someone, pending payment. Has the herp hobby grown that much that breeders are running out of snakes? (and I'm not talking about corns, well...some higher end morphs of corns I guess).

Ahhh, I feel much better! Anyone else care to vent?
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www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes

Yes,i need to vent myself.What the hell is it with all these people loosing there darn corns?How hard can it be to buy a screen lid and weight it down?I cant wait till Kingsnake puts up some sort of fact sheet covering the simple basics of keeping a cornsnake.Lately it seems like every other day someone is having a heart attack about an escapee.While they all have my sympathy they also are the ones that frustrate me to no end.All snakes are escape artists and till everyone realizes that i can see many more OMG my snake escaped posts.People, corns can fit thru any small gap or hole period.It's your job to double check even triple check your inclosure to make dang sure the snake cant get out.I use 20 longs with screen lids that i weigh down with either other cages,or phonebooks.The weight ensures no gaps period.It's not a pretty site using phonebooks but by god it hasnt failed me yet.....Paul.

While I understand your view It does happen. I lost one of my hatchlings last summer. But it was an "assisted escape", I had put together a simple lidless rack for the hatchling boxes and one of my cats pulled one of the boxes out of the rack just far enough to let the corn escape. The next day I nailed on a couple simple little "swivel stick" posts so the boxes couldn't be pulled out when the sticks were vertical. But I did the OMG when it happened (Of course this was also avoidable, since I knew before it happened that my cats are all able to open cupboard doors and drawers, so grabbing the lip of a sterilite box and pulling it out a bit is cheese after that.)

As for holding pending $, I wouldn't have a clue, I've been holding one hatchling now for 10 months! haha, but it's for my brother Anyone else I would maybe give them a month unless it was a really pricey snake, then I can maybe see longer "payment plans" being arranged. I wouldn't do it, but I'm poor and paranoid
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Dianne
AKA IcedGoddess
6.7 Cornsnakes
1.3 Cats
0.1 Child
IcedGoddess Creations
Castle Serpents

Well, since we are all venting here, I would like to vent about those of you who think that your way is the best way. "What the hell is it with all these people loosing there darn corns?" Well, Paul, it's not like it is a fun new game, I have never heard of someone loosing their animal on purpose. In fact, I had a screen lid with locks that my baby ball python couldn't move before he was moved to something bigger. So don't tell me that I don't know "the simple basics of keeping a cornsnake." The screen lid WAS fine, I had to unlock the supid thing to get into his tank, and only then did I know that he was missing, I looked in his hides and no snake. So next time you decide to bash those of us that love our animals and treat them as one of the family, why don't you think about what you would do if your oh so sophisticated phone book method were to fail. I doubt you would be so smug then.

no need to be so hostile...this was supposed to be friendly venting...no need to be so upset...I doubt Paul meant to offend anyone...don't take it so personal...

I am by no means perfect and I have been keeping all sorts of snakes for a long time. In fact, when it comes to the overall majority of reptile species, I would say I am an amateur.

However, I have NEVER lost a snake yet. This is something I take great pride in. Is it luck? maybe...OR is it simply thinking things through with the knowledge that NO snake wants to be kept in an enclosure, even if its as big as a 12'X12' living room. I don't care anyway you slice it...they are ALWAYS looking to escape. The sooner a keeper realizes this, the better. Its really a simple matter of territory. In the wild, they have plenty of it (in most parts anyway). In captivity, they are trying like heck to get out of their 20 long cage...and find their way home...like Nemo! LOL

The best method to prevent escapes is simply to be one step ahead of them. When I put a snake in an unproven enclosure, I usually put that enclosure inside of anothe one...this way if the snake escapes, you won't need to look to far and loose a valuable pet. Snake escapes are easily preventable this way. Otherwise, its like leaving your gate open to your backyard and not expecting your dog to run away! LOL
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www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes

>>The best method to prevent escapes is simply to be one step ahead of them. When I put a snake in an unproven enclosure, I usually put that enclosure inside of anothe one...this way if the snake escapes, you won't need to look to far and loose a valuable pet. Snake escapes are easily preventable this way. Otherwise, its like leaving your gate open to your backyard and not expecting your dog to run away! LOL

But what about the snake that has spent months, yea, over a year even in an enclosure...it is secure, it is shut correctly and the snake is gone one day? That has happened to me.
Yes, I dare say some newbies would underestimate the strength, intelligence, or slitheriness of their new friend. But sometimes it just happens. I personally think you have been careful....and lucky. I don't see why it should be a blame issue or a "I am a better keeper" issue anyway.

BTW, my dog's don't have a gate. They don't have a fence. They don't have zap collars or anything. THEY are boundary trained.
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Sonya

Haven't we warned you about tampering with the structure of a chaotic system?
Mrs. Neutron

But what about the snake that has spent months, yea, over a year even in an enclosure...it is secure, it is shut correctly and the snake is gone one day? That has happened to me.
- I am not trying to be mean or anything but I just don't understand how that could happen?!?!?!

Yes, I dare say some newbies would underestimate the strength, intelligence, or slitheriness of their new friend. But sometimes it just happens. I personally think you have been careful....and lucky. I don't see why it should be a blame issue or a "I am a better keeper" issue anyway.
- I never tried to imply that it was a "I am a better keeper issue". I do think that if you lose the animal, there is no one to blame...but yourself. Afterall, there is a responsibility we all take on by caring for live animals and doing everything possible to ensure that the animal will not get loose is part of the responsibility. I can't imagine that a venomous keeper would agree that 'sometimes it just happens'. There are ways to prevent escape, it should never 'just happen'. Its simply in one form or another carelessness on our part. I am not trying to be mean or start an argument or anything...its just my thoughts & feelings on the matter and until I experience otherwise...? I guess resp. also lies in the seller providing proper care info to a buyer. How many people sell an animal just to profit from it with no further help or follow-through? In some cases, the seller has a responsibility to help their buyers with successful/proper husbandry techniques. A simple care sheet with a new purchase (outlining potential problems of escape, etc) could go a long way. But its not a perfect world and very few do this.

BTW, my dog's don't have a gate. They don't have a fence. They don't have zap collars or anything. THEY are boundary trained.

- My current dog is too, the reason I brought that up was b/c the gate to my yard broke was blown open and my dog could care less...He was happy being in his domain/territory and didn't wish to be more than 10ft from home. Although, I grew up with Schnauzers that would run the first chance they got when given the chance. You'd think they were being tortured and not spoiled..LOL I'll attach a pic of my dog just for laughs!
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www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes

n/p

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www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes

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Dianne
AKA IcedGoddess
6.7 Cornsnakes
1.3 Cats
0.1 Child
IcedGoddess Creations
Castle Serpents

>>n/p
>>
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>> www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes

Boundary trained snakes.....wouldn't it be great?
I had a 5th grade teacher whose daughter had an Eastern Indigo that she swore had the run of the house. Slept in a sweater drawer, never ran off. Came out and would hang out with them.

I have Border Collies, they do frisbees, and balls, and sticks and.......
I also have a Bullmastiff. You throw something for him and he might go get it once....then he is like "If you wanted it so badly what are you throwing for? Go get it yourself. Or get one of the spaz dogs to get it for you, I am laying in the sun, guarding you."

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Sonya

Haven't we warned you about tampering with the structure of a chaotic system?
Mrs. Neutron

n/p
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www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes

Just because it will hold a fat ball python in doesnt mean it will hold a pencil thin corn in.I dont trust clips, never have never will.That's why i use weight to apply equal pressure around the edges.Ive seen people silicon the inside edges of screen tops just to be double safe.Some screen lids like mine also have a gap in a corner for putting power cords through for those who wish to cook there corn on heating rocks.I taped those shut.If i hadnt noticed them i could have been in big trouble.I posted an escape i had with a burmese down below.I wish you the best of luck finding your corn...Paul.

>>Just because it will hold a fat ball python in doesnt mean it will hold a pencil thin corn in.I dont trust clips, never have never will.That's why i use weight to apply equal pressure around the edges.Ive seen people silicon the inside edges of screen tops just to be double safe.Some screen lids like mine also have a gap in a corner for putting power cords through for those who wish to cook there corn on heating rocks.I taped those shut.If i hadnt noticed them i could have been in big trouble.I posted an escape i had with a burmese down below.I wish you the best of luck finding your corn...Paul.

I used weather stripping (the 1/4 thick foam sort) on lids for Dekay's and Green snakes. Also, I never trust a plastic framed lid. Go for the nicer screen sorts if you are using a tank. And don't weigh them down unevenly so they bow.
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Sonya

Haven't we warned you about tampering with the structure of a chaotic system?
Mrs. Neutron

hey it happens don't bash people for a mistake. I left a lid open that i thought i had shut found the snake about a hour later under a piece of carpet that was on the floor.

HEY,

Sorry to hear about your mistake. Look on the floor; in cabinets and under dark places. Seal all openings to furnaces, doors, windows and dishwashers. Leave some bowls of water and dishes with thawed pinkies in them in different rooms. try putting flour on the floor before you go to bed, and see if you can find tracks in the morning. Put crinckly bags on the floor, so you can hear it slithering across them from another room. These tricks have always revealed that mischievious little guy. Just remember to never give up. Good luck!

DAVE