Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was looking through some of the older comments and ran across one that made me wonder ... do you have some S. varius? I tried to obtain a pair from Mike Kiedrowski through the classifieds but was denied the required permit. Get this ... I told the fed who processed my application that I wanted these awesome lizards as PETS!!! What a DOPE I am! The ones being offered were genetic excess. Mike didn't need them for his breeding program so I figured what's the diff? Big diff, apparently.

Anyhow, I can't have the varius. Just curious if you were lucky enough to get some and wondered if they become tame like the little chucks or if they're pretty wild. They sure are something else. I drool every time I look at the picture of them that I printed off the classifieds.

Yes I have 3.4 S. varius. They were a gift from the Arizona Sonora Desert Museum. Don't feel too bad I think most of the out of state sales of Mike's got turned down. I know a heck of a lot of people in AZ bought and will probably be producing babies in the next year or 2 and I believe the price will come down. They are more like a cyclura than a chuck. They need a lot of work to get tamed down. They are nothing like a hispidus which usually get dog tame.

Some babies.

Another male. They tend to be less psycho than the females who are absolutely crazy. While growing up the babies I had to seperate the 3 because at about one year of age they started trying to kill each other. They were a male and 2 females.

Well Tom, you're making me feel a LITTLE better about being rejected for a varius permit. I'd assumed these big chucks had the same general disposition as the aters, which have absolutely the most engaging, friendly, awesome personalities of any lizards I've ever had. From your comments, I get the impression the varius creatures aren't quite as smart and ... well, EVOLVED? ... as the aters??? But what they lack in cute personalities they surely make up for in plain ole' looks. They are SO cool to see.

So, I'm confused ... what used to be S. obesus is now ater ... right? But what's hispidus? Is that the Angel Island chuck, and is it big like the varius or small like the ater?

Thanks for sharing those pictures. So, are you a vet like Mike and that's why the Museum GAVE you some varius? I'm impressed and VERY jealous!

Yes S. obesus is now S. ater. What I am unclear on is whether they will keep the subspecies or not but I do not think so. I don't think there will be an ater ater or ater tumidus etc.. S. hispidus is the Angel Island chuckwalla also known as spiney or black chuckwalla also. They are one uniform color and do not have the different color tails. They are by far the nicest of the chucks personality wise. They are bigger than ater but not quite as big as varius. I think an average size would be 22-24 inches. They can become like lap dogs.
I am not a vet. I am an auto mechanic by trade. I guess I just got lucky and got in with the right people and have been working with chucks a long time (not as long as some people on this forum like BJ). I think Brian Jones has been working with chucks forever. Plus I have built a good working relationship with the museum in about the last ten years By the way I have some yearling male hispidus available if interested e-mail me off of the forum for details.

Hi Tom,

I guess you've explained the species to lots of folks, lots of times, but could I please get ONE more rendition?!? I posted a pic of my chuck girl, Bonnie. Did you see her? Which species is she? She's small (SVL 5.5", mature (12 years old), and uniformly very dark brown. I've always assumed she was simply S. obesus (now ater) but am wondering if she's a hispidus since she's all dark brown. But she's never gonna be 20-some inches long. That could be cuz she rarely has access to natural sunlight (we're in West Virginia). She has absolutely the sweetest disposition possible. She routinely walks over to me and climbs up onto my lap! What do you think about her?

Then there's Clyde. He's dark brown also and small like Bonnie. But he has an orange back and tan tail. I'll post his pic as soon as I have some time. What's he sound like?

Thomas, Peggy, Sim (male), and Sylvia are all light tannish brown, pretty uniform in color, and all about that same 5-7" SVL in size. Again, their growth may have been stunted due to lack of nice hot natural sunlight except for maybe 10 days a year when I'm home on the weekend and we have a sunny day and there's time to drag out all the outdoor cages and transfer the lizards outside for the day. They all eat well and are fat. Just not long. Can you guess all of their species from those descriptions?

As far as your male ater, I'd LOVE to have him, specially if he looks anything like the gorgeous Grebster, but I'm like you sound ... out of cage space. The third male did me in. Thomas has to live where I work, which is excellent as far as I'm concerned, and healthy for him as he has all the lights and heaters he should. But that stretched the bounds of my lizard life about as tight as it can go since guy chucks have to have their own spaces. I don't dare push things any further with my employer or my spouse! I AM looking for another female or two. Know where I can find some? I really want more dark brown girls because Bonnie's getting old and one of these days, she's not gonna be around any longer. That's not gonna be a happy day. I get pretty freaked out when I think about not having a friendly, cute little dark brown girl in the house. How long do captive chucks typically live, anyway? I have no idea. Maybe 12 years isn't that old, huh?

Anyhow, thanks for answering! It's been real fun to hear back from you!

Sue

(Hey, I'm stupid! Is MI Michigan or Minnesota? I was really surprised you don't reside in the southwest desert area. Also, how does one reach you off the forum, like if I was able to have your male ater?)

Your chucks are S. obesus obesus now known as ater. I forgot to mention that females are usually all tan to brown and sometimes with band tails but not always. I know a guy in Canada that bought a chuckwalla as a young adult and it lived with him for almost 25 years which would put the age over 25 so they are capable of living a long time. The chucks I have available are hispidus not ater. If you need to contact me off of the forum just click on the blue tgreb at the top of my post and that will let you e-mail me. Also I have a friend in South Carolina that has 2 yearling female ater available. If interested contact me by the way described above. Tom

Well Tom, I'm having a real hard time wrapping my mind around how crazy the varius are. You mean, you had to separate the females from the male even? Cuz things got too nuts? Wow! And these aren't lizards you'd particularly be able to play with and enjoy handling them? Even those cute little babies in the picture grew up mean? Did you and the family try to handle them a lot to tame them down? Were you disappointed that they reacted like they did, or doesn't that bother you?

You also keep and breed the small chucks, right? You're where Eve's Grebster came from, huh? Do you incubate your eggs in an incubator or outside in the sand? I'm assuming you live in Arizona or Nevada, huh? I want to move there SO bad but the mean old husband WON'T.

I had a Cyclura cornuta for a long time and she was something else. Loved her lots and she was SO beautiful to behold, but her name was Heloise cuz she was the cyclura from HELL. She'd as soon take your hand off as eat her collards. Can't IMAGINE a chuckie could behave so badly as her, but guess that's what you're saying, huh? But in the final analysis, you just put up with the attitudes cuz they're so good-lookin'.

Yes and no. The babies are growing up to be better than the adults I got. I worked a little with them but not as much as I would have liked to. They may have become tamer. The young male does allow me to pick him up if I take it slow and easy. The 2 youngs females are still spastic. You hit the nail on the head with the aggression thing. It is the old saying crap flows down hill. The biggest is the toughest. The biggest would try to kill the 2 smaller ones and the middle one would try to kill the smallest.
I used to breed a lot of ater but got out of them completely last year to concentrate on the varius and hispidus neither of which I have bred. I needed bigger cages for them and could not do it with the other chucks. ALso I could not afford the electric bill. I am not in AZ but in MI. Yes Grebster was one of the animals I produced.