Reptile & Amphibian Forums

just got some new babies in, theyre so small,.. i forgot they came this tiny, but theyre awsome by my account, lemmie know what you think,

kain and abel are brothers born from a littler of entire "reverse stripe surinams", and the parents that produced them have been producing solid litters of reverse stripers for 2 years now im told (i wanted one last year but couldnt afford em [xx(]). ive seen them labeled as guyanas as well so there is some confusion in my eyes as to their lineage, but none the less, ive seen pic of the whole litter and am (as are others) convinced its a genetic trait. (anyone out there with more info on these guys than me please interject, im looking for more info on them, as well as more OF them)

and this is zoe... shes a sweetie, got her from central florida reptile breeders... i think when shes grows up shell make a great mate for one of the boys... shes got a little striping of her own on the tail, and the traditional sadles and marking i wanna see go with the reverse stripe []. hopefully some day....

anyways, im super stoaked on these guys, thanks for lookin,

>>just got some new babies in, theyre so small,.. i forgot they came this tiny, but theyre awsome by my account, lemmie know what you think,
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>>kain and abel are brothers born from a littler of entire "reverse stripe surinams", and the parents that produced them have been producing solid litters of reverse stripers for 2 years now im told (i wanted one last year but couldnt afford em [xx(]). ive seen them labeled as guyanas as well so there is some confusion in my eyes as to their lineage, but none the less, ive seen pic of the whole litter and am (as are others) convinced its a genetic trait. (anyone out there with more info on these guys than me please interject, im looking for more info on them, as well as more OF them)
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>>and this is zoe... shes a sweetie, got her from central florida reptile breeders... i think when shes grows up shell make a great mate for one of the boys... shes got a little striping of her own on the tail, and the traditional sadles and marking i wanna see go with the reverse stripe []. hopefully some day....
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>>anyways, im super stoaked on these guys, thanks for lookin,
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"To be the best..........You must lose your mind."

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as far as I know. That is what the breeder has been selling them as for the past two years or so. Last year somebody bought the last of the litter and resold them as guyanans, although he bought them as surinams. Also, Peter Watson purchased the father of your babies and the year before from the breeder. I believe there is atleast one gravid unrelated female from him this year, so we will see if the striping is all him or the result of pairing him up with a sibbling. He doesn't show any tail stiping but does some minimal striping by way of a few connected saddles. Peter also owned a sibbling to the father and I believe he tried to breed them to each other also, but I'm not sure if she took. Bill Parks could probably tell you more about the bloodline... that little girl from Chuck is a beautiful little boa.
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"If woody would of went to the police, none of this would have ever happened!"

SURINAMES? THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION, SO NO HATE E-MAILS PLEASE! I WILL TELL MY ACCOUNT ON THESE ANIMALS AND THE PURCHASE OF. I ACQUIRED A 2.1 TRIO OF THEM AT THE ATLANTA SHOW LAST YEAR FROM JOHN WADDELL. I ASKED HIM IF THEY WERE WC OR CB AND HE SAID THEY WERE CB. I THEN ASKED HIM IF HE PRODUCED THEM. HE SAID NO, SO I ASKED WHO DID? JOHN NOR HIS PARTNER WORKING THE TABLE WITH HIM COULD TELL ME WHO PRODUCED THEM. THEIR STORIES ALSO CONFLICTED ON OTHER QUESTIONS I ASKED ABOUT THE BOAS. AT FIRST THIS LED ME TO BELIEVE THE BOAS WERE WC. AFTER FURTHER EXAMINING THE ANIMALS, I CONCLUDED THEY WERE MOST LIKELY CB. WITH THE LOCALITY AND BREEDER INFO BEING SO VAGUE, IT WOULD BE VERY HARD FOR ME TO SAY THEY ARE DEFINITELY SURINAMES. THEY POSSESS THE CHARACTERISTICS OF MOST GUYANAS. ALL I KNOW FOR SURE IS THEY ARE SOME OF THE MOST INCREDIBLE BOAS I'VE SEEN.

I COULD'VE SOLD THESE BOAS MUCH EASIER HAD I CALLED THEM SURINAMES. I CALL IT LIKE I SEE IT AND AFTER 24 YEARS EXPERIENCE, SEVERAL THOUSAND BOAS, AND ALOT OF SHADY REPTILE DEALERS, UNFORTUNATELY I LISTEN TO VERY FEW PEOPLE IN THE REPTILE BUSINESS THESE DAYS. ESPECIALLY PEOPLE THAT HAVE JUMPED ON THE BOA BANDWAGON IN THE PAST FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AND SEEM TO KNOW IT ALL. I HAVE ONLY SCRATCHED THE SURFACE IN THE LAST 24 YRS.

hey bill... yeah i was reffering to the ones you had up last year (or earlier this year?..either way) and just didnt have the money at the time. the guy that bought one from you is of the opion that their guyanas, and CE and the folks that they were bought from claim surinam... either way, its undisputable that they are awsome... i wish i had gotten to them in time to grab some of the litter picks with the stripes going up the back. and some females to.

wasnt trying to stir anything up by questioning their lineage, was looking for exactly this, more feedback on their history...
i never really heard back

CE and bill, thank you for your insight. if either of you (or anyone else for that matter)come across anymore information regarding these guys id love to know.

sean mills.

I guess I am glad that I have been keeping them for seven years... I just narrowly missed the 'wagon'.
- Eric

you bought them as something and sold them as something else regardless of what you were told. Is this the first time you did this? NO.. Will it be the last? I doubt it.. I understand you've been keeping boas for a years but that doesn't mean you are the boa god. Nothing gives you the right to change the na,es of the animals for whatever your reasons are... some people actually care if the parets originated in one country or the other... I personally don't, but you can be damm sure if I purchase an animal as a surinam it will be sold as such when I decide to part with it. Maybe I have only been aroung kingsnake for 3 years but I've been keeping boas for almost 20 years... I may be new to the game but I know JUNK when I see it. Take that any way you want!
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"If woody would of went to the police, none of this would have ever happened!"

Just because you say it is something doesn't make it right. Who do you think you are?

And how many BCC have you actually produced in those 24 years? Buying gravid females doesn't count! Lets hear from the breeders, not the brokers.

I AM A HOBBIEST AND AVID COLLECTOR, ALTHOUGH I HAVE BEEN LUCKY ENOUGH TO PRODUCE SEVERAL CLUTCHES IN THE PAST 24 YEARS. I HAVE PRODUCED A COUPLE OF CLUTCHES SO FAR THIS YEAR AND HAVE SEVERAL MORE CLUTCHES TO COME. I THINK MY "FOR SALE" POSTS ON KINGSNAKE WILL ANSWER THIS QUESTION FOR EVERYONE. ON THE OTHER HAND, I HAVE NEVER ONCE BROKERED AN ANIMAL FOR ANYONE, PERIOD. NEVER HAVE AND NEVER WILL. MAYBE YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE WORD "BROKER" MEANS. PLEASE REFER TO WEBSTER'S, I QUOTE THE DEFINITION FOR YOU: "AN AGENT WHO BUYS AND SELLS FOR A FEE." I AM NOT A BROKER NOR AN AGENT. MAYBE YOU DON'T KNOW THE DEFINITION OF "AGENT", I WILL QUOTE THIS FOR YOU AS WELL: "A PERSON ACTING OR DOING BUSINESS FOR ANOTHER." I HAVE NO PARTNERS, HELPERS, OR ANY OTHER AFFILIATES. THIS IS MY HOBBY AND MY PASSION AND I TAKE FULL RESPONSIBILITY FOR MY ACTIONS. IT'S ALMOST MIDNIGHT AND I AM STILL OUT FEEDING ANIMALS AND CLEANING CAGES. I CAME IN TO TAKE A BREAK AND CHECK MY E-MAIL. I MUST NOW RETURN TO WHAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT....THE WELL BEING OF THE ANIMALS.

YOU KIDDING? IF THE MAN THAT SOLD THEM HAD SUPPLIED ANY SUBSTANTIAL BACKGROUND INFO THAT THEY WERE SURINAMES, I WOULD HAVE CALLED THEM SURINAMES. THEY APPEARED TO BE GUYANAS OR AT LEAST WHAT I CALL GUYANAS. DO WE REALLY KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SURINAMES AND GUYANAS? I THINK NOT. I HAVE MY OPINION ON WHAT A SURINAME SHOULD LOOK LIKE AND I HAVE MY OPINION ON WHAT A GUYANA SHOULD LOOK LIKE. DOES THIS MAKE IT LAW? NO, IT DOESN'T. IF YOU CAN SUPPLY ME WITH ANY BACKGROUND INFORMATION ON THESE BOAS OR THE BREEDER OF THESE BOAS, THEN PLEASE DO. IF NOT, THEN STOP KIDDING YOURSELF. IF YOU HAVE ANY FACTS PLEASE POST THEM. IF NOT, THEN YOU ARE DEFINITELY STEERING THE WAGON. BY THE WAY, HOW MANY OF THESE ANIMALS HAVE YOU POSSESSED TO BE MAKING SUCH STRONG STATEMENTS?

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Ok
There are many valid points and opinions. The truth is what we all seek.
I believe changing names of animals is wrong and deceiving...but if the buyer knows what is
going on and the seller is up front with the buyer regards the name change what the hell
the seller has a gun to the buyers head. (where I come from it is the opposite) But I know there
are some A*#$@#*s making up stories just to sell.

With all the opinions with what is JUNK and what is not? is again a opinion so to
new hobbyist or all of us on the BandWagoon or anybody getting offended about
some of you TOP collectors on this site call somebody's pride and joy Junk don't let it bother you!
I'm fighting for the little guy... Why do I bring this up... Because I own one the those
Rev. stripe surinams. And I think it's is beautiful regardless of name or X-cross bred I don't
give a F*@! to each it's own..... But I 'm one of those who still want Facts and history info about them for
my own sake. I'm Sorry I had to express myself in this thread
I know you were just making a point and expressing your opinion
CE I think your collection and photos are some of the nicest on this site.
collectors like you make this site Great. I admire your collection/gallery weekly
No bad blood I'm fighting for the little guy... who look up to collectors like yourself.
No a@$ kissin' here just the truth
and sorry upfront if I'm mistaken ....if you were not calling the R.stripe surinam JUNK "MY BAD"

Back to the Facts of the R.stripe SURINAM Any more info or pictures of the parents???
please post.......

I may just started collecting different localities of redtails
but I have good friends to help educate me. Jax2001 is my son's name and year he was born.. not when I started collecting I had my first boa 19 years ago and had several along the way but only started a collection this year... I'll drive the Bandwagon at least I'm not a walking fool!!!! at the end of the day
who ever has the money can buy the BEST end of story..

again NO HATE
Back to the HISTORY of the R.stripe SURINAM Any more info or pictures of the parents???
please post.......
Thank you GUYS for the great info so far ... Let the truth come out!!!!
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those are some cool looking critters. I am looking for photos of the father... If Pete was around I could just ask him, he bought him last year after he bred.
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"If woody would of went to the police, none of this would have ever happened!"

>>those are some cool looking critters. I am looking for photos of the father... If Pete was around I could just ask him, he bought him last year after he bred.
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>>"If woody would of went to the police, none of this would have ever happened!"
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"If woody would of went to the police, none of this would have ever happened!"

this was linked from www.allboas.com ,.. a great site by a great guy, though ive only emailed a handful of times, he seems super polite and friendly... he gives gredit to pete watson as well for being the owner of "dad". while CE said he shows no reverse stripe,... i would say he has a minor reverse stripe. as well in the previous photo CE posted, his medalions stripe, my neos show this trait as well, not to the degree that dad does, but the family resemblence is there. id love to know about mom actually as well. im just throwing this in cause CE just posted the only other photo of this guy ive seen.

i really had no intention of any flames getting started here, was just looking for background info, and i really appreciate all thats been given guys!

a sister to the father. I know he tried to breed them together but I'm not sure if she took or not. There may be one other female gravid from him, but with PEte's loss all the info was lost too. Hopefully when the babies are born the reverse striping will show and we will know the male was successful.
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"If woody would of went to the police, none of this would have ever happened!"

I should have asked you first before jumpin' to conclusions.. my bad...

Great Pic thank you...
so is that the father to all of John Wadell's boas he sold?
I heard through the grapevine they might be xCross? Is that true?