Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Can I keep 2 indian stars in a 40l tank or should I just keep one. I can not keep them outside b/c where I live would be too cold and way too many raccoons. So I have a 40 L tank and I was hoping to put a pair in there.
Thanks
Christina
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1 Russian Tortoise (Willy)
1 Ornate Box Turtle (Lily)
1 Red Eared Slider (Chester)
2 White's Tree Frog (Kermit & Phil)
1 Red eyed Tree Frog (Justin)
2 Big Eyed Tree Frog
2 Bubbling Frog
2 Tiger Leg Tree Frogs (Akari & Shiro)
3 Amazonian Milky Tree Frogs
1 Dwarf Megophrys
1 Rainbow Burrowing Frog??
1 Praire Dog (Timmy)
2 Chinchillas (Layla & Snickers)
4 mice (Gabby and friends)
1 dog (Holly)
2 Cats (Champ & Bear)

Oh and a husband

from World Chelonian Trust article on star torts:

HOUSING STAR TORTOISES INDOORS - A reasonable size for a hatchling is 2 feet by 2 feet, (60 cm by 60 cm). As the animal grows the size of this habitat should be increased. For an adult Star tortoise the indoor habitat should be at least 4 feet by 4 feet, (120 cm by 120 cm).

Rest of article here: 66.201.110.205/Articles/Geleganscare.htm

I don't know the dimensions of a 40L, but the 40-gallon tanks I've seen are about 3'x1.5', or barely large enough for a single hatchling. In fact, there are no readily available tortoises or box turtles that should be placed in a 40-gallon tank for their entire lives.

In my opinion, a 4"-8" tortoise/land turtle should be given at least 8-16 sq ft. I give my russians about 4 sq ft of space *each* for a few weeks before and after hibernation. During that time they are dull and sluggish - partly because they are slowing down or recovering from hibernation - but also because a tortoise stuffed into a small space just gives in and doesn't move much. Either that or it struggles against the cramped quarters.

For the rest of the year, my 3 adult russians share a 64 sq ft pen, and my juvenile has an 18 sq ft pen to himself. They come to life with this much space, and spend time grazing, sunning, chasing each other, laying eggs, etc.

I have 3 three-toed box turtles that share a 13 sq ft space outdoors, but they are temporary adoptees waiting for a better home. This is not an optimal setup for them.

So unless you have a lot of space to devote to a tortoise, I would recommend you don't get a star. An Egyptian tortoise might be able to survive in 4-6 sq ft of space, but from what I've heard they are not cheap and not easy to keep.

Let me ask you this how quickly do stars grow, b/c I am currently planing on giving my russian his next tank one size up he is in a 40 and he grew pretty slowely. Can I start them out in a nice small tank to help keep them warm and then gradual move them into bigger things.
Also could possibly post some pics of your indoor setups.
Thanks
Christina
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1 Russian Tortoise (Willy)
1 Ornate Box Turtle (Lily)
1 Red Eared Slider (Chester)
2 White's Tree Frog (Kermit & Phil)
1 Red eyed Tree Frog (Justin)
2 Big Eyed Tree Frog
2 Bubbling Frog
2 Tiger Leg Tree Frogs (Akari & Shiro)
3 Amazonian Milky Tree Frogs
1 Dwarf Megophrys
1 Rainbow Burrowing Frog??
1 Praire Dog (Timmy)
2 Chinchillas (Layla & Snickers)
4 mice (Gabby and friends)
1 dog (Holly)
2 Cats (Champ & Bear)

Oh and a husband

You'll have to read up on the stars, I have no experience with them. Since stars can reach 8"-12", and the russian hatchling I have reached 4" in about 1.5 years, I'd say they could potentially need a larger tank in a very short time if stars grow like russians.

My indoor setups are nothing special. I have no way to link photos at the moment, but I have one russian each in a 30"x20" concrete mixing tub. Two adult females share a 42"x20" melamine box. Each enclosure has a 100-watt basking bulb and either an 18" or 48" low-UV fluorescent bulb. I use newspaper as a substrate and soak the torts regularly. These are only designed to hold the torts during the slow times of the year (a few weeks). Otherwise they are either hibernating for 3 months or outdoors for 6-7 months.

By late March or early April the torts will move to the outdoor enclosures which are 8'x8' and 6'x3'.

np
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1 Russian Tortoise (Willy)
1 Ornate Box Turtle (Lily)
1 Red Eared Slider (Chester)
2 White's Tree Frog (Kermit & Phil)
1 Red eyed Tree Frog (Justin)
2 Big Eyed Tree Frog
2 Bubbling Frog
2 Tiger Leg Tree Frogs (Akari & Shiro)
3 Amazonian Milky Tree Frogs
1 Dwarf Megophrys
1 Rainbow Burrowing Frog??
1 Praire Dog (Timmy)
2 Chinchillas (Layla & Snickers)
4 mice (Gabby and friends)
1 dog (Holly)
2 Cats (Champ & Bear)

Oh and a husband

I just have to ask one question. How in the world have you managed to keep a Russian alive and in good health for 9 years in a 40L tank?

I don't see how this would be difficult at all for one Russian tortois. I've got 5 in a 2 x 4 area and they are no worse for the ware. As I said earlier, if you provide them with things to do they seem to be quite at home in a small area.
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Ed
Tortoise_Keepers-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Trying to keep the fun in Chelonian care

Ed,

For two old guys with 30 years of tortoise keeping under our belts I guess we found a second thing we disagree about. Mazuri was the first.
Space is the second.

.
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Ed
Tortoise_Keepers-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Trying to keep the fun in Chelonian care

I'll disagree with you Ed, but I won't feel a need to cast doubts on your tortoise-keeping or your character.

I like to provide as much space as possible for my animals. They behave differently. When I provided a 13 sq ft space for three adult russians (including a hiding area and things to crawl over and under), their activities consisted of basking and not basking. The male would be interested in mating, but the females couldn't get away and seemed stressed by it. Of course this was indoors and they would be more active outdoors even in a small enclosure.

But when outdoors in an 8'x8' pen they are very different. They use all of the space in the pen and often come creeping over when I pass by. They eat everything in sight and grow big and generally seem perkier. When I kept them indoors year round they just were not this lively.

So I work to keep their time in the small space indoors to a minimum. I've decided that since I don't have a lot of room to devote to tortoises that I should do the best I can for a small group of animals instead of compromising for a lot of animals.

I've seen some 5'x3' cement mixing tubs listed on the net. Now those would be great for my indoor setups. Two torts per tub.

Do you happen to remember where you saw this size cement tub? Thanks.

Troya

Here:

www.tufftubs.com/htdocs/mixingtub.htm

I haven't made the effort to find a local distributor.

I think I'm comfortable with both my caracter and my tortoise keeping ability to deal with the doubt that many people try to cast... it makes no difference to me. I believe that the majority of the people have the brains to think for themselves and can take or leave any suggestions anyone has to offer.

As to the space issue, it all depends. For me it is sometimes better to provide a smaller space so it is easier to control and monitor the environment and the animal. I do this in the case of rehab animals or juvenile animals.

Providing as much space as you can is not a bad thing... I'm just saying that a reptile can do just fine in a smaller space.
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Ed
Tortoise_Keepers-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Trying to keep the fun in Chelonian care

Not in the least. No one way works for everybody or every tortoise.

You can easily keep 2 Stars in a 40L for at least 7 or 8 years if you are starting with hatchlings. They seem to grow very slowly. Also, if you provide structure and the like you can effectively double the available floor space.
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Ed
Tortoise_Keepers-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Trying to keep the fun in Chelonian care

np
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1 Russian Tortoise (Willy)
1 Ornate Box Turtle (Lily)
1 Red Eared Slider (Chester)
2 White's Tree Frog (Kermit & Phil)
1 Red eyed Tree Frog (Justin)
2 Big Eyed Tree Frog
2 Bubbling Frog
2 Tiger Leg Tree Frogs (Akari & Shiro)
3 Amazonian Milky Tree Frogs
1 Dwarf Megophrys
1 Rainbow Burrowing Frog??
1 Praire Dog (Timmy)
2 Chinchillas (Layla & Snickers)
4 mice (Gabby and friends)
1 dog (Holly)
2 Cats (Champ & Bear)

Oh and a husband