Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hey, I just bought my first leopard geckos today. I found 3 young ones (probably 2-3 weeks old) at a pet store on the way home from the airport (I had been reading up on them after seeing them in a pet store in florida while on vacation). My girlfriend convinced me to buy all 3, so i did. they are about 3 inches long, standard leos, and they're great. I have them in a 20 Gal (long) tank, with some rocks to climb on and hide under (my girlfriend's parents own a pet supply store so i got over $200 of supplies for about $75, which was nice). Anyways, I have them on sand right now, but I'm thinking about changing it because i'm worried about the impaction problem. I bought 2 dozen krickets and threw them in there coated with some multi-vitamin powder, and i'm letting them eat at their leasure so i can gauge how much i should feed them over the next few weeks.
So far I love the guys (well i'm not sure they're guys) and i'm hoping i don't have 2 or more males... :/... but yeah, they are kind of shy to my hands, but they haven't been in the new cage for very long. I'm planning on trying to handle them enough to help tame them, and I might try to hand-feed them some, so they learn to trust me more and are more open to me feeding and handling them. What time of the day should i let them rest and what time should i try to get them out?
I have a heat pad attached to the underside of the Tank, not inside of it, however i'm not sure if they're getting enough heat. My room is about 70 degrees, and the heat pad should add more on one side of the tank.... Man i've talked too much, so anyways- I love my new geckos, if you have any tips please tell me, and I hope they grow healthy, later.

-W

get them off sand ASAP. Also you need to have like 3 good (not half log/cave) hides in the tank for them. Also the rocks need to be stable so they do not fall and crush the geckos. the temps should be around 90 degrees right on top of the substrate on the whole warm side and around 80 degrees right on top of the substrate on the cool side. What i mean by the whole warm side is not just a small hot spot that is 90 but the whole depth. What are you using to measure temps? what are the temps at? what kind of UTH do you have? is it hooked up to a dimmer/thermostat?
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0.1 "Tremper" looking Albino Leopard gecko (Lex)
0.0.1 normal ball python (felix)
1.1 Feral cats that we adopted (Fuzzy, and Bear)

Alright, I've read up some more and yeah, i'll take them off of the sand either tonight or tommorow morning. They have one log-like hiding structure, one huge (almost as wide as the cage and as long as about half of it) stone thing to crawl under (which is what they usually use) and they have one or two other small places to hide. I made sure the rocks were very stable, and right now I don't have any kind of thermastat or anything (On my way back from the first pet store i was at towards the other one i started to get a migraine (where i start to lose my vision, etc) so i had to come home immediately) and so i'm not sure about the temp. the cool side of the tank is probably about 75 degrees and the hot side 80-85, to be honest. When i take the sand out, the temperature will rise, obviously, so that should help. And i have no idea what a UTH is...

Ok man u need a digital therm and rheostat or something to turn things off when it gets too hot. A UTH is under tank heater and it can take your sand up over 100 degrees trust me. If you can just use a bulb (daylight bulb) until u get a better set up try to monitor the warm side temp to what everyone else has said and get some moist hides goin so they can shed properly. One gecko for me has been a god forsaken nightmare up to this point. Please get things in place or your gonna have 3 sick geckos. Mine came home happy and fat, ate a batch of crickets and has worms and damn near ready to check out. Im force feeding, monitoring temps and in the hundreds of dollars. Please dont follow me down this road. Ive even done everything on my part correctly... And one more thing just because your warm side looks to be 85 degrees etc, its colder in thier moist hide by several degrees. Those walls therms are junk. Get a digital, they dont lie... best of luck with everything.

Oh and if there isnt something for those crickets to nibble on they will take a peck at your geckos. Ive witnessed that at one point and that was just when they were in there to get fed, so imagine whats going on when you arent looking

Well I just took about half an hour getting all the sand out, I had some trouble getting it out of the edges and i think i actually cracked the bottom of my tank a little, it's fine though. I replaced it with paper towels for now, and i'll look into a new substrate. I took the remaining krickets out and if they're alright tommorow i'll feed my geckos in the morning. So exactly what temperature should each side be? And how much do digital thermostats cost? Also, can i put the sand back in when they are older? like at 6 months, a year? Thanks

Paper towels should be fine for a while, it's the best substrate IMHO. If you want to move to sand later on, you should wait until they're all atleast 6" in length. Repticarpet is a nice alternative if paper towels are boring to you, just put some paper towel where they go to the bathroom so you don't have to wash it every other day. People also have had good results with tiles.

Yes, geckos can be fed evening and morning (twice a day), it'll make them grow faster too. Some geckos however don't like eating so much and may not eat for you if they're feeling full, and other geckos eat too much and they vomit from eating too much (though they learn not to eat so much after one or two vomitings).

The cool side can be as cool as 60 deg without much harm, but I recommend 70-75'ish. The warm side should be atleast 85 deg for proper digestion, up to 90 deg is fine, but don't exceed 95 deg (on the surface of the substrate).

Digital thermometers can be bought at Radioshack for around $20, some are cheaper, some are more expensive, but $20 is the normal range.

A dimmer or thermostat might come in handy too, you just plug whatever you're heating element is into the dimmer/thermostat and plug the dimmer/thermostat into the wall and dial in the temperature you want.

-Lemur 6

Ok, I understand about the thermostats now, that seems like it would work quite well, I'll look into that tommorow. How much water do leopard geckos drink? I haven't seen mine drink at all and don't hear much about it, and seeing as they are from a desert/dry region i would expect they don't drink too much.

Hmm... sometimes I used to wonder about water too. Apparently mine gets more than enough water (he poos alot of water), but he never uses his waterbowl. I have a humid hide with paper towels and I've seen him lick the papertowel and I'm guessing that's where he gets most of his water (which also forces me to clean it alot more often that I'd like).

-Lemur 6

Mine comes out religously at 10 pm and gets a long drink from the water bowl. Thats about the only thing shes doing right these days HAHA

Just wanted to add that a cracked tank and UTH arent friends, it could be dangerous. Just what u wanted to hear right?

Temp on warm side 85-90 cool side 70s someone else may clarify that more for u seeing how Im still watching my warm side like a hawk.

Digital therm with probe about 25 bucks at Walmart or Meijer.

Honestly Im just about to give up on the UTH and keep moist hide at 85 to 88 with daylight bulb and then use a red bulb at night to maintain close to the same temp or maybe 80 to 85 in moist hide.. Maybe someone will tell me different on that. From what I gather they need good belly heat 24/7 to fight disease parasites and to digest hence the UTH. My bulbs are keeping my moist hide at those temps w/o the UTH because I cant afford the rheostat just yet. Even tho my credit card is sitting right here to possibly order a rheostat tonight LOL. The only source of light needed is for day and night and season rotation for the gecko.

So in summary possibly a person could use lights over top to keep temps on moist hide surface to par, Or go with the UTH and just a tube (grow light) over top for day and night light.

Just a few things I know and a few things Im still toying with because as u can see from my posts Im not the expert but Ive learned aLOT and thought I would share

Hmmmmmmm another migraine sufferer. I haven't met many who get the visual auras, do you lose your vision completely or just get the flashy things? I start off with flashy things then lose the vision completely in one eye, usually the left. I've had them last upwards of 72 hours where i spend time alternating between my bed and the washroom or just sleeping IN the washroom LOL. My doc said i have the worst kind of migraine cause i can have all the symptoms of a stroke (slurred speach, can't walk straight etc.) but i'm starting to get better, the dizziness that usually lands me on my butt isn't as frequent now. I used to be on so many meds it was sick and the side effects were sometimes worse than the pain, so i'm off everything now. It still frustrates me though when i do get them (weather changes lately have led to a few). I've had so much to do but all i want is to stay in bed. I just got access to another room so this one is now my gecko/computer room, the other my bedroom. The organization that still needs to be done is just overwelming but i haven't been able to really get going at any of it.

Sorry for rambling. Not many people understand the severity of migraines, they aren't just simple headaches.
I hope you were able to take something before it got to bad
Red

>>Alright, I've read up some more and yeah, i'll take them off of the sand either tonight or tommorow morning. They have one log-like hiding structure, one huge (almost as wide as the cage and as long as about half of it) stone thing to crawl under (which is what they usually use) and they have one or two other small places to hide. I made sure the rocks were very stable, and right now I don't have any kind of thermastat or anything (On my way back from the first pet store i was at towards the other one i started to get a migraine (where i start to lose my vision, etc) so i had to come home immediately) and so i'm not sure about the temp. the cool side of the tank is probably about 75 degrees and the hot side 80-85, to be honest. When i take the sand out, the temperature will rise, obviously, so that should help. And i have no idea what a UTH is...
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Crested Gecko Zeek:1.0, Ziggy and Zeus
LEOS: Boo: 1.0 normal , Bronx & Nala: 1.1 blizzard,
Lily: 0.1 patternless, Abby: 0.1 albino, Zoe: 0.1 reduced pattern, Dot: 0.1 hypo
New Girls: Flame, Karma, Bubbles and Bell pics coming soon
Chip: 1.0 papillion (small dog)

Yeah, I get them pretty bad too. When i do, I'll notice that my vision is a little messed up, and then it will spread and i'll lose close to all of my vision on my left side. I'm on some medicine (Inderal every day and Zomig for when i get one). They have been pretty severe before but w/ the Zomig it isn't too bad. I've learned how to deal with them over the past year or so, so if i get one i'll usually just go in my room, cut all the lights off and block out the window and try to sleep. Light seems to make it worse. And i know what you mean about sleeping in your washroom. One time, I started to get a migraine at like 11 in the morning and i woke up at like 7 that evening in my bathroom, and couldn't remember anything that had happened except a lot of pain and throwing up. Good times.. heh.

I must admit that mine are getting better. For years i was bedridden and keeping a job was next to impossible. With migraines lasting days i took alot of time off work. Now though i've had to learn to deal with them so they don't control my life so much. I tried all the medications, but decided that mind over matter worked better for me. I've been to the hospital alot and even with demeral shots it didn't help. So now i simply say to myself i'm not allowing them to control me anymore and i go about my day with the pain. Its only when i start getting sick that i have to stay home. One of the overnight shifts i just did started off with a migraine, i was sure i was going to get sick on the drive into work but i got there and then spent the entire night cleaning and reorganizing the house along with my regular work. Within 2 hours i didnt' even notice the pain anymore LOL. Do you ever get dizzy or numbness before or with your migraines? Its like a warning for me along with the auras. My tongue and half my face goes numb, happened earlier so i'm due for the pain in about an hour LOL.

I am going to go clean out my tanks then it'll be time for me to go to work. I don't know about anyone elses geckos but mine go to the bathroom so much i can't let one day go by without cleaning. I like schedules so i dont mind. i have everything on a schedule now, like clockwork, when i'm not doing overnight shifts that is LOL. The routiene definelty helps me stay focused when the pain starts.

Red
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Crested Gecko Zeek:1.0, Ziggy and Zeus
LEOS: Boo: 1.0 normal , Bronx & Nala: 1.1 blizzard,
Lily: 0.1 patternless, Abby: 0.1 albino, Zoe: 0.1 reduced pattern, Dot: 0.1 hypo
New Girls: Flame, Karma, Bubbles and Bell pics coming soon
Chip: 1.0 papillion (small dog)

Make sure you put down a few layers of paper towels when you move the sand. If you just put them in there, dont handle them for at least a week. Let them get comfertable in their new home first. ANd when you start to handle them, dont just grab them. Wait till they will walk on your hand freely. This might take a while but it will ensure that they wont drop their tail. I would take all of the crickets out if i were you. The best thing to do is drop a single cricket by their hideout and moniter until they eat it. If you just drop the crickets in there and come back later, you never know who ate what. One leo might be the only one eating, not to mention crickets stressing out the leos when they arent hungry.

Also, sand is never good for leos. I dont care what age, there is still big risk. Many have kept their leos on sand and never had problems, but many have had problems. Its just not worth the risk. Its so much easier to keep the tank clean with paper towels anyway.

In my opinion the best substrate is tile. It's easy to clean, it holds heat well, if you get vinyl you can cut it to size of the tank, and it's a heck of a lot more attractive than paper towels! It's a good thing you have them off the sand, babies should NEVER be on sand. When they get older you could put them in a partially sand tank (very little sand compared to the other substrate); If you wanted to do that the best way would be with slate and filling in the cracks with sand, or with tile and leaving an open area at the end filled with sand. If you did want to put them back on sand I would keep the water bowl away from the sand, and feed them mealies in a dish (so they aren't eating in the sand). The biggest issue with sand is accidental injestion (or in some leos purposeful injestion in an attempt to get more calcium), in the wild leos do not purposely hunt on sand, and so aren't injesting a ton of it every time they eat. Anyway, that's my opinion on the whole subject of substrate...and I'm not trying to start another war...there have been no definitive studies proving the how dangerous sand is or is not, and so for now remains a matter of opinion. I know of no one who has had a leo (that didn't purposely injest the sand for some reason) with the sort of setup I described that had it die of impaction, and so believe that type of setup is safe.

Anyway...as far as in general...

As far as general things...
-make sure you have a humid hide setup for them, they need it to shed! To make one just take a margerine cup or a gladware thing (darkened in some way so the hide isn't clear...then its not a hide...lol) and cut a hole like halfway up and then use damp paper towels or moist moss inside of it. They need a moist hide to be able to shed properly.
-as far as water just make sure there's a dish of clean water available at all times...a lot of leos get all the moisture they need just from their food and/or humid hide, but keep a dish there for them if they need it; I know mine use theirs.
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Christina

2.3 leos
-0.1 tangerine het rainwater albino w/jungle background (Blinkers)

-0.2 jungles (Vahz & Skissor)

-1.0 tremper albino (Spitfire)

-1.0 tangerine rainwater albino (Bronx)