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I'm getting a pygmy in the near future, and I've read all sorts of stuff on how to house them, but everything I've read says something different. I was thinking maybe using a wooden frame and covering it with an open (not like cutting holes in it but just not so it will kill the poor thing) mesh fabric. Does that sound feasible/okay? Thanks!
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~Nancy
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0.1.0 9 year old West Highland White Terrier - Bridget
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1.0.0 Red-Eared Slider Turtle Hatchling - Jared
1.1.0 Fire-Bellied Toad - Mohammed & Moses
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Hi Nancy,

I commend you for doing your research well in advance and being prepared – and yes, you will find mixed info. ChamNews has an article on Brookesia (the other small cham species) that may be helpful to you as the requirements are similar (see link at end).

I had a trio of R. brevicaudatus last year that I lost after 4 months. We do not know why. They were in "optimum" habitat, captive born, got them from a well respected breeder, had researched for quite awhile ahead of time - in other words I had done everything right and was devastated when they all died within a matter of days of each other . There is still much unknown about them especially where supplementation is concerned (whihc may have been the cause). I tell you all this first just to let you know what my experience was. That said, I would get them again, I would also get them from he same breeder, however I do not recommend them for a first time cham keeper. I know they are adorable, and yes, some folks have been successful with them first time out (trinacliff, on this forum, had similar losses to mine but still has a couple).

One of the things that make them so appealing is also part of the problem - their size. If they have an illness it is very difficult, if not impossible, to diagnose and to treat. I do recommend you secure a knowledgeable herp vet before even thinking about getting them and one with some chameleon knowledge.

OK, you asked a simple question and I gave you a dissertation! LOL! I do not think you could maintain enough humidity in any sort of mesh enclosure. A tank is best with screen top and good ventilation (one side or slotted at top as well). They need more ground space than height, lots of highways and byways to travel back and forth, cool areas to retreat to, regular misting…

So if you are determined to get them I would suggest getting captive born, get from a reliable, knowledgeable breeder, DO NOT buy them from a pet store and if you get them at a show…well, again, know your source - and MOST importantly have a vet already lined up. I see you have some herps so this may not be an issue Here are a couple sites for you:

www.chameleonnews.com/year2002/sept2002/brookesia/brookesia.html

www.adcham.com/html/taxonomy/species/r-brevicaudatus.html

lele
vets by state and country

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0.1 veiled - Luna
0.2 green anoles Jaida & Jetta
0.1 brown anole - Jamaica
0.2 house geckos - Gaia & Tia
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Líta

I have a trio pygmy leafs myself, 1 male 2 females. I have them in a 20 gallon tank. There is a drainage in the bottom middle for the water to escape. I have a layer of coconut fibre at the bottom then a layer of peet moss then a layer of reptibark and live moss. Inside for them to climb on are 2 ficus benjaminas 3 variegated petite scheffleras and a sanderiana. along with plenty of sticks to climb on and deadleaves to hide around.

I mist them 2 times a day with 24oz and i have a 75watt daylight on them which keeps the temp between 70-80. I also need a night light on them because since its always humid in there it can get a little cold so the night light keeps the temp around 65-70. I have read you do need uvb for them and i have read you dont need it. I use it anyway. it doesnt hurt.

I feed them small crickets and fruitflys every other day. I have noticed they walk on the sticks on the ground instead of the actual ground most of the time so i made sure to have a path to get around everywhere. There is so much cover in there it takes me forever to find them sometimes i give up trying to find all 3.
OHyeah i have a screen on the top so the flys dont get out a tiny little fan i turn on for them for short periods of time every few days to help breeze it up.

Sounds good, how long have you had them? My set up was similar except my substrate layerying was diiferent so I would have drainage below soil (used layers of peastone and charcoal). You misting sounds a bit intense especially if you actually need to have a drainage hole - but hey, if it's been working... May I make one suggestion - rather than having a night "light" on them try a ceramic heater. That's what I use for my geckos in the middle of winter when the night temps can be a bit low at night in the house - it works great. This way the light does not disturb their sleep pattern.

Curious as to your dusting/supplement routine? How old are they?

lele

>>I have a trio pygmy leafs myself, 1 male 2 females. I have them in a 20 gallon tank. There is a drainage in the bottom middle for the water to escape. I have a layer of coconut fibre at the bottom then a layer of peet moss then a layer of reptibark and live moss. Inside for them to climb on are 2 ficus benjaminas 3 variegated petite scheffleras and a sanderiana. along with plenty of sticks to climb on and deadleaves to hide around.
>>
>>I mist them 2 times a day with 24oz and i have a 75watt daylight on them which keeps the temp between 70-80. I also need a night light on them because since its always humid in there it can get a little cold so the night light keeps the temp around 65-70. I have read you do need uvb for them and i have read you dont need it. I use it anyway. it doesnt hurt.
>>
>>I feed them small crickets and fruitflys every other day. I have noticed they walk on the sticks on the ground instead of the actual ground most of the time so i made sure to have a path to get around everywhere. There is so much cover in there it takes me forever to find them sometimes i give up trying to find all 3.
>>OHyeah i have a screen on the top so the flys dont get out a tiny little fan i turn on for them for short periods of time every few days to help breeze it up.
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0.1 veiled - Luna
0.2 green anoles Jaida & Jetta
0.1 brown anole - Jamaica
0.2 house geckos - Gaia & Tia
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Líta

They are WC so i think about a year old. Ive had them a couple months so far.
i want to get a ceramic light its just i had the other bulbs so i felt i didnt need to get one immediatly. The night one doesnt make any light tho but even with the day light on there is plenty of shaded spots that never see light.

I mist them that much because it does dry up kind of quick and they like to drink off the plants. The humidity is usually around 80. not much drains out but i dont want it to sit in the bottom. I read vivariums need drainage so thats why i added one.

I gutload my crickets and i have been dusting with a multi-vitamin every other week. I have tried feeding them small silkworms and waxworms but they aren't interested.

The 3 of them are so funny to watch. they are always interacting with each other. Sometimes they get a little mad and do this swaying thing back and forth real fast almost swaying right off thier branch. Most of the time they just hang out all together on the same ficus. its like a little gossip house in there.

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>>I gutload my crickets and i have been dusting with a multi-vitamin every other week....

Do you dust with calcium at all?

>>I have tried feeding them small silkworms and waxworms but they aren't interested.

yeah, I found crickets and FF to be the only thing they would eat

>>The 3 of them are so funny to watch. they are always interacting with each other. Sometimes they get a little mad and do this swaying thing back and forth real fast almost swaying right off thier branch. Most of the time they just hang out all together on the same ficus. its like a little gossip house in there.

LOL!!! I just looked at my pix of them and I have some funny ones of Bart (named b/c he looked like Bart Simpson - i think it's those big googly eyes!) climbing all over Makeda - the ever-patient one. They would often congregate and other times be at separate parts of the tank. Hope yours continue to do well!

lele
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0.1 veiled - Luna
0.2 green anoles Jaida & Jetta
0.1 brown anole - Jamaica
0.2 house geckos - Gaia & Tia
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Líta

Thanks
With the gutloading i think they get enough calcium. There is plenty of D3 in the crickets as it is, i dont want to feed them to much. if you know what i mean.
After reading one of your links you suggested to check out, i have had half a mind to try and work out if i can put in some mantellas with them. I think that would be really cool but I have been reading about keeping them and it just seems a lot harder. maybe not, i dont know.

(since i just figured out this numbering system
0.1 Vield cham -Medusa
1.2 pygmy leaf chams - Dude, Gumbel, Pat
0.1.1 eastern box turtles - Rowley, Duffel
0.0.1 3-toed box turtle - Cole
0.0.1 sulcata tortoise - Samson

Hi Andy,

I also have 3 R. brev (1 male, 2 female) for 5 months now, anyway they have been laying a total of 14 eggs since late Feb. I'm wondering if you have any experience on this? As told, incubation time will normal take from 60 to 75 days. Is that true?

Cool!
I dont know if mine have become gravid yet or if they even laid any eggs. But yes I have read that that is the incubation time. But i dont know if its the incubation time if you are taking them out and doing it yourself.

With my naturalistic setup i dont think i would ever be able to find the eggs if one of them did lay them. I just read that if this happens, if the tempetures and humidity are high enough that they will hatch and even be living for 4 months with out you even seeing them. You, of course would just need to make sure their is small enough food for them to be hunting in there.

Maybe someone else has had experience with thier eggs.

My question, which i have been wanting to do, is add a reed treefrog or mantella in with them. I would have to redesign their vivarium but i think it would only look nicer.
:O or if i could even add in my hatchling boxies. Their climate right now is identical. I think that would be really cool looking to watch but just doesnt seem right. chams from tanzania, boxes from new jersey?
sorry such a long post. thanks for reading.
any suggestions or knowledge that could enlighten me about this subject?

Yes, I agree, food source would be a problem for those little one...

I also wants to add other species with them, but to what I observed, they're easily get stress. So, unless you've got a big tank for them, otherise I don't suggest to combined them with other species.

Well, good luck and pls keep us update of your progress.

Hi there.
I've kept 1,1 R. Temporalis, and actually I thought about putting them in the bottom of my Uroplatus Guentheri terrarium. I didn't do it, because they're too fragile when it comes to stress. I know Uroplatus is nocturnal in opposit to the Mantella, but I think you will experience, that the animals will suffer from it.
Be happy that they are working perfect, which is great!, and enjoy watching the pigmys in one cage, and your mantella in another. I think you will run a big risk (lots of keepers tell about stress as the reason for their animals to die) putting the mantella in.

Well. This is my advice, but I will tell you another story: A friend of mine has R. Brevicaudatus. They are living in the bottom of his Uroplatus Phantasticus terrarium. Here, they are breeding very well, and they are working perfect. So perhaps it depends on the specie too? Good luck whatever you choose. There is no definite answer in my oppinion.
Kristian, Denmark.

say they did have a large enough tank, what do you think they possibilities would be for them to try and eat the frog? I mean it is a tiny little thing walkin around. Do you think they would think its just a strange cricket and try and eat it?

My pygmys dont seem to get stressed over much so I don't see that being much of a problem. Especially since i can hardly ever find them from all the cover they have, unless they have climbed up high.

I of course would do a little remodeling to add in a little stream thing that filters through. Theres no chance of the chams drowning, is there? even if the water is only like 3mm deep?

Oh I through you're going to introduce the frog which has almost same size as the pygmp. Anyway, sure they will treat them has food if it comes to a smaller size.

Instead of staying in the bottom, mind pygmps tends to climb in branchs ~1 feet above the ground. Also, the male loves to search around try to find a way to escape: )

Thats funny about your male. Mine does the same exact thing sometimes. always trying to escape.

You really think they would go after a frog for food though? im gonna say the size of it would be about the size of a dime. maybe a nickel.

Ha, that's funny. Perhaps their male instinct makes them search around for new territories.....

Well, let us know how they're doing when you'd introduce the new room mates