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Wild Caught balls? Lots?? Captive "born" (hatched)??

bloodycats Apr 03, 2004 10:48 PM

I own four balls. Two normal CBB females, one ghost male and a pastel male.

This time of year depresses the heck out of me. People selling "lots" of babies, especially females, gravid wild caughts, different looking imports. It makes me sick inside.

I know things like Ralph's platty and the father of ALL ball morphs-- Bob Clark's founding albino-- are necessary for the hobby. This includes things as "subtle" as pastels and cinnamons. I agree with collecting the "rarities" for this hobby (and the survival of the species' sake). Not many true rarities come out of Africa yearly, however. And those that do are worth it IMHO when you weigh the environmental impact with the trauma of taking them from their homes.

What I am concerned with are the CH babies shipped in my the thousands. So they're females for your homo males-- so what?? Why not spend the extra cash for a captive bred and born baby? I know the answer already. "New blood" (which reading some facts about albino and snow boas seems like a very good argument to me) and the fact that they are inexpensive. There is even another argument that hurts me greatly, that collecting gravid balls makes a living for many people. This sucks because A. balls are being exploited and
B. that those people have to resort to catching these snakes for a living. It would not trouble me if p. regius was totally over-plentiful, but according to the documents I've read, no one knows what toll on the natural BP population this collecting is taking. That's not good.

Of course if a human and snake were in horrible predicaments and I had to save one I would go for the human. As an American, I feel as if my views in the world are skewed just because of who I am and this rich country where I live. As someone who adores ball pythons, I want to do what is best for both them and their natural habitait. I have read the BP classifieds every day for nearly 3 years now, and am tempted by ads of captive bred and born babies, but also "new blood." Is this encouraging the over-collection of wild balls?

What can we as ball entusiasts do to keep this hobby thriving AS WELL AS the natural environment they are found in? After all, the morphs we value so much have originated in the bush. I do not want to start a CB vs CBB vs WC argument here. I know they can all do well with the touch of a good herper and I do not look down on CH or WC owners. I just want to know what people think about the collection and conservation of ball pythons now in 2004 when there are many being produced in captivity. I want to conserve them in the wild AND as pets. (If anyone tried to take my prt/breeder BPs away due to a health/safety/conservation issue-- anything-- I'd want to die! I am very attatched to them!)

Right now, I feel conflicting vibes from the ball community. I think we can all tell who is in this for the animals and who's in this for the cash. If we want this industry to last, we need to get rid of those in it for the cash!! Ball pythons live a very long time! Please post your opinions here.

And just to make sure everyone nderstands me, I want to say once more I do not think owning/buying/importing wild or CH balls is terrible, horrible and bad. In fact I think it is necessary in cases.

As a ball python owner and enthusiast I would like to know what other BP lovers think about WC and CH balls, as well as knowing peoples' opinions on the impact importing BPS has on their wild polulation. I think we can all use the conclusions in our buying, selling and keeping experiences.

Replies (6)

meretseger Apr 03, 2004 11:30 PM

I don't think it's the morph breeders who are buying enough WC's to support this trade. It's new owners and pet stores that supply new owners who don't want to pay more than 10 or 15$ for a snake. And yes, many people are this cheap. The only way to fight this is to get the word out that beginners should only be buying CB animals. It's better for the snakes, the owners and the entire industry. I own WC animals (not balls), but I see it as a very great responsibility and only buy them when there's really no other options.
-----
Eryx - All the fun of a boa in a convenient pocket size!

chrisssanjose Apr 04, 2004 12:57 AM

Good post!

Personally, I would like to see the importation of ball pythons
stop almost altogether. I don't have exact totals, but there
is somewhere in the order of 100,000-200,000 ball pythons
imported every year.

I don't think the 'new blood' argument has much merit.
It's been years since I've read it, but in Ross' "Reproduction
and Husbandry of Pythons and Boas", he calculates that in order
to maintain a genetic diversity you need to have something like
50 unrelated animals (might have actually been pairs...I can't
remember). Over the last 20 years, there has probably been
2-3 MILLION ball pythons imported! Yes, some of them were
related (sibblings), but this is such a ridiculously high number
that the 'new blood' theory is not valid. Note: I'm not saying
you shouldn't have a diverse set of animals in your breeding
collection. What I'm saying is that you can easily obtain "new
blood" buy picking up a ball python just about anywhere in the
USA!

If they stopped importing tomorrow, you wouldn't see a need for
'new blood' in the USA in your lifetime...or probably ever!

Now...if you want to talk about importing new 'morphs', that is
a different topic.

Note: I have purchased imported animals. Not for 'new blood' though.

Just my opinion...
-ChrisS - SanJose

bachman Apr 04, 2004 09:07 AM

It's not going to stop, unless it becomes illegal. Importers get Balls for $3.00, and sell the babies for $5.00-whatever. The thing that pi$$e$ me off is the people selling normal imported Balls (that they paid $3 for) for $500.00 or more when they are obviously normal Balls, but they give them a cool morph name.

Later

reptilewild Apr 04, 2004 10:38 AM

I totally agree with you.They find one small pattern or color and then try to jack the price up $200-$300 dollars more.Just plan greed right there.Peace

jsherps Apr 04, 2004 01:26 PM

>>I totally agree with you.They find one small pattern or color and then try to jack the price up $200-$300 dollars more.Just plan greed right there.Peace

At least it's blantatly obvious who does that on the classifieds though.
-----
Jeff H.
http://www.jandsherps.com

superchunk Apr 04, 2004 04:28 PM

i agree with all the posts regarding wc/ch/cb etc.---i'd like to add a few things just for thought---another depletion issue is that ball pythons(royals)are a very big food source for africans--yes,they eat them; lots of them--Ghana,Benin,etc. don't have local supermarkets like we do--they collect snakes for nutrition and the hides--just imagine how many b.p.'s a family of 6 consume in a year- multiply it out for 4 entire countries-- it adds up--this might help ease your mind next time you are holding a beautiful ball python--thanks for reading-brian

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