Reptile & Amphibian Forums

ok i am thinking of getting 2 D. tinc. 'Cintronella's and 2 D. azureus (later on down the road more) but ya will they be okay in a 90 gal setup once they are adults if i keep them together in a 10 gal for a while till they are full grown ( and no i'm not planning on breeding them (well at least not in the 90 and no not mix breeding either if i do) but ya the 90 has a lot of hiding spots including 3 half coconuts and 3 clay pots along wiht a half a log and good foliage ( pics soon) and the 10 gal has a half coconut and a clay pot. thanks for all your help and again please respond and dont' be mean lol

Nick

I personally say who cares. Mix them let them breed frogs will be frogs....Just don't try to sell the darts to me or any one else as a new breed or morph. I personally dont like mixing because animals tend to pass illness faster if proper quarantine is not followed. 90 gallons is huge and could support many darts. Don't worry about mixing because of breeding even if you say your not gunna breed them they do this on their own so good luck stopping it.

Darryl
Dart-frogs.com
Try this site for much help
Dendroboard

I disagree with the previous poster for a couple of reasons:

Those two species are not suitable to mix in a tank as small as a 90 gallon. Females of both species are extremly agressive and when kept in groups are known to fight to the death (this can extend across species boundries). This is why these two species are generaly kept in pairs. They occupy very similair niches in the wild and would be in constant competition with each other. Also, even though you intend not to breed them, they will breed. Tincs and Azureus are two of the most easily interbred species and you probably will not be able to distiguish a hybrid tinc from a pure bred one.

If you are going try a mixed setup, mix across genera: like a species of Phyllobates with a species of Dendrobates. Also keep the stocking density low.

Also I don't understand the conection between mixing and qurantine mentioned by the previous poster. Could they please explain?

Often when you buy two darts not for breeding purposes they were initially kept separate from different darts or morphs. If you dont catch that one has parisites or some ill ness that doesnt present right away because maybe it has a natural resistance to the parasite/infection. You could be risking its other house mates. I let months pass and treat throughly before ill pair a set of darts for the first time. This is the same as if your mixing 5 leucs all from different breeders. And 90 gallons is small I disagree. In michigan infact there is a tank at Preuss animal house that they have 1 azureus, 3 tincs various morphs, and 1 Leuc. they all keep there specific space. Darts only defend a small area of space and they won't descriminate between another tinc, azureus or phylobate so any mix or strictly one species can fight(a pic of a tinc and a pumilio fighting comes to mind). If you follow the rule 1 frog for 5 gallons there is more than enough room. Also he is not breeding them ie. he doesn't want to raise tadpoles. It will be impossible to stop them from breeding but he doesn't have to raise the tads.

Darryl
Dart-Frogs.com

I was just a little confused about what you meant with the quarntine/mixing issue. I understand about quarntining frogs, I just fail to see how it is any different for a mixed tank then for one with the same species from seperate breeders.

For mixing purposes a 90 gallon is small. However, for a single species tank it is huge. I will reffer to a Dutch style set up. We generaly regard the Dutch as having mastered the art of vivaria, and most keep mixed tanks. Have you ever worked out the gallonage - 100 plus, most are around 300.

I don't mean to start an arguement here, but do you have any experince keeping a mixed tank? Because I do, almost 3 years worth now. And based on that I stand by my points.

Also, I didn't want to breed my auratus but that hasn't stopped them. Every week or so they lay a clutch and a week later I see the male taking the tads and finding a bromeliad to put them in. It requires no help from me.

Just wanted to comment on the breed issue. I agree with you that they will breed if they want to breed no stopping them. But also in a 90 gallon it would be very difficult to find the eggs or tads to "dispose" of them. I wouldn't want to have to get rid of any eggs anyway even if i didn't want them in the first place. I guess it goes with the reponsiblities of the tank??

just my two cents

I normally don't come to this board, I don't have darts. I do keep many other species & oh yeah...I mix 'em. That really seems to send people into a frenzy. So I thought you would be a perfect person to discuss this issue with. What species do you mix? How big is your set up? 3 years is pretty good, my mixed tank is tree frogs (and a salamander) that has been going strong for almost 2 years. I would like to hear more on other's experiences with mixed species tanks. I also appreciate your reference to the Dutch methods of vivarium design & stocking, you have obviously done your homework!

Thank you,

My mixed tank is 135 gallons. It currently houses 0:1:0 Agalychnis callidryas and a 1:1:4 group of Dendrobates auratus. Up until a few weeks ago it also housed two Phyllobates bicolor, but as the pair of auratus intesified their mating efforts they began to become very agressive towards the two bicolors. So I removed them. Though, it is doubtful that this behavior would have had any impact on the bicolors, the possiblity of having a group of 15 to 20 auratus in there seemed very appealing. I have tried other species combinations with less then sucsess.