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Legend #1: The war on Iraq is necessary because they have weapons of mass destruction

Truth: No weapons found

Legend #2: The war on Iraq is neceassary to fight terrorism and make the world a safer place

Truth: It would be the same when the fire brigade try to extinguish a fire with gasoline

Legend #3: The Iraqis are a bunch of cowards

Truth: It's really an act of bravery when the #1 military power is attacking a worn-out country that suffered first the war on Iran, then the first gulf war and afterwards more than 10 years of embargo. Furthermore: Allies were included in the attack on Iraq. I recall that back in school we called those one cowards who attacked the weaker ones and on top of that several against only one.

Legend #4: The people in Iraq are glad that we rid them of Saddam.

Truth: Oh, really? I didn't look it.

Legend #5: We will establish a democracy there.

Truth: Yeahh... the mullahs are already waiting to install sharia's law.

Legend #6: The people in Iraq are glad that we are here.

Truth: They have a weird way to show it.

Legend #7: We have everything under control there.

Truth: If this means under control then I don't want to see what happens when things get out of hands there.

Legend #8: Terrorism has already decreased due to the war on Iraq

Truth: Say what?

Legend #9: We will make the Middle East more stable.

Truth: Yes, that's true. When the entire Middle East is ruled by the Mullahs then it will be more stable.

Legend #10: The Iraq is a place full of terrorists

Truth: Yes, now it is. But not before the war.
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Beware of Commies and Mutts!

Truly concise and to the point. It's a shame that people IGNORE he obvious truths so that they can be comfortably disillusioned
with the lies. ANYTHING to keep thinking the same. Even if it doesnt work. Even if it costs lives. NO price is too heavy to pay, wouldn't you agree?

Great post,

Fredrick Albury

... it seems that all the war supporting voices are muted now due to the developement in Iraq.

Just curious, but how do you come to those ridiculous conclusions?

For instance, there are about 25,000,000 Iraqis and a little over 115,000 US soldiers in Iraq for over a year. This means that there are probably around 5,000,000 adult Iraqi men that could have been attacking our "hated" 115,000 troops and yet there have only been about 400 deaths due to attacks in an entire year! (Remember, about 200 of the 600 were from accidents and not even combat related!)

And you think that means they pretty much "all" hate us? If just one percent of those 5 million Iraqi men fired on us, and if just one percent of those one percent were able to "make one kill" within a year, there would be a 25% larger casualty rate than we have had!

Then there are the weapons. We have found and destroyed over 30,000,000 tons of weapons, and counting. Yet the weapons of mass destruction we are looking for are only 250 tons worth. How can you be so sure this tiny amount isn't still hidden somewhere or that it was moved or even destroyed after we started the envasion? And you consider 30,000,000 tons of conventional weapons to be so insignificant that the Iraqis never had a chance against our military, but you consider 250 tons of WMDs so significant that we absolutely, positively would have found them by now?

And as for their bravery, are you not even aware that we are having problems turning the country over to the Iraqis because the Iraqi police keep dropping their weapons and running away whenever they see a conflict coming?

Rodney

If everybody who hates someone straight from the heart would kill this person the world would be rid of human beings soon.

Not every Iraqi citizen who hates the U.S. is a murderer.
Maybe you should have a look at the throngs of Iraqis who are demonstrating against you.

And before you produce the next statistic: Not every person who is against something is going to a demonstration.

And the Iraqi police officers are dropping their weapons not out of cowardice, they just refuse to shoot their fellow citizens.

Regarding the weapons of mass desctruction: None found. You can not discuss away this issue. Period.

By the way, a German journalist (Peter Scholl-Latour) uttered his surprise recently in the German TV that the CIA hasn't yet buried some for the U.S. soldiers to find it.

I must say that this is something that I have respect for.

You guys made a bad mistake.
You will leave the Iraq in shame.
Iraq will become an Islamic republic.

You will not see an effective force of Iraqis in great numbers Rodney. As I have tried to point out before. They fight best as Guerilla's. Historically, partisans have often been more effective than big armies. it only takes a few determined men to keep a whole army busy. History is full of examples, from our own indian wars of the South West to the French resistance and the Afghan-Russian conflict.

Just as you chose to disagree with me about the rebellion I predicted would happen....you also fail to see the effectiveness of this kind of war. They will not quit. Parts may disappear or be beaten, but they will keep coming back. In the end we will leave Iraq and the partisans will install their own government. That's just how it is.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

"They fight best as Guerilla's."

I agree. I just find it hard to believe, that in a country of 25 million people, if they hate us so much as H+E Stoeckl has said, that their guerilla tactics have only had an effective casualty rate of under .4% in a years worth of fighting us. That's an unbelievably low number if you ask me. Especially considering how militaristic the Iraqi society is, how available guns are, etc.

I believe, as every poll I have seen has said, that the majority of Iraqis want us there and support this war.--and the minority is fighting us.

"Just as you chose to disagree with me about the rebellion I predicted would happen....you also fail to see the effectiveness of this kind of war. "

I see the effectiveness, and I never said that a minority wouldn't rebel. (I always expected that) I said that I didn't believe that the majority of Iraqis would.

"They will not quit."

Again, I agree the fanatics won't quit. But we are killing a lot of them, and the non-fanatics are not fighting us.

"Parts may disappear or be beaten, but they will keep coming back."

The dead ones won't!

"In the end we will leave Iraq and the partisans will install their own government. That's just how it is."

Maybe, maybe not. Everyone said they would never sign an interum constitution either, but they did.

(I just wish we let our troops use force more effectively than we do. Rules of engagement are too strict in my opinion. I have heard from some people that have come back that it is easier to use deadly force, as a police officer in the states, than it is to use deadly force in Iraq. I wonder how low the casualty rates would have been if they had been freed up a bit.)

Rodney

A small point. I DID expect them to "Sign" an interum government agreement. But historically in the Arab world...Signing and actually going with their word are too very different things.

One more. Guerilla war does not have to produce heavy casualties on the enemy to be effective. The effect is more financial and psychological, which is what makes it so effective. People just get tired of fighting them and eventually leave.

At one point it was estimated that it cost a million dollars to kill a single Vietnamese guerilla. Think inflation and how much do these Iraqi casualties cost us. Not a good issue to bring up in a country (us) where gas is hitting $3.00 a gallon.
Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

I have seen the protests, maybe you should read some polls. Like the ones conducted by Baghdad University, or Gallup, or ABC news. They all show the majority of Iraqis support this war and don't want us to leave yet. I have never seen a poll of the Iraqis to the contrary.

Why look at just the demonstrators? You claim that not all Iraqis that hate us will take up arms against us. I agree. So the "fighters" don't reflect all the "haters" in your words. But then you want to just look at the Iraqis that demonstrate against us (for the cameras) as representing the entire Iraqi public? Don't you think that ignoring the ones that support us is doing the exact same thing that you are arguing against, in your "hate vs. arms" argument? (Using a small segment, that act, to try and say that is how most believe.) If those that take up arms don't represent all those that hate us, then those that protest can't possibly represent those that don't like us (or like us) either. Kind of hypocritical to make that argument ("look at the protesters" don't you think?

"Regarding the weapons of mass desctruction: None found. You can not discuss away this issue. Period."

I agree none have been found. Acting like it is a fact that none were ever there, just because none were found, is wrong. (Especially considering what a small amount it is, relatively.) And ignoring the fact that every intelligence agency in the world believed the same thing is wrong also. Its not a mistake to act on information that everyone in world believes is true at the time.

"By the way, a German journalist (Peter Scholl-Latour) uttered his surprise recently in the German TV that the CIA hasn't yet buried some for the U.S. soldiers to find it."

More nonsense from a conspiracy theorist. If they were going to plant WMDs, they would have done so months ago when the heat was really on to find them. The fact that they didn't should show you the honesty level of this administration. Instead of trying to think up what they "might" do in the future, to try to discredit them, why not look at what they have done, with the information they had at the time.

And by the way, the German intelligence also said Saddam had WMDs.--since you are quoting a German, I thought I would do the same and quote an entire German agency.

Rodney

Legend #1: The war on Iraq is necessary because they have weapons of mass destruction

How do you know, cause the media hasn't reported it?

Legend #2: The war on Iraq is neceassary to fight terrorism and make the world a safer place

Truth: The world is a safer place because Saddam isnt hiding or harboring terroist anymore.

Legend #3: The Iraqis are a bunch of cowards

No one has said they were, but what do you call hiding in a church to get away from your opposers?

Legend #4: The people in Iraq are glad that we rid them of Saddam.

Yes, they are and have you been there??? I dont think so...so how would you know?

Legend #5: We will establish a democracy there.

Give it time, Rome wasn't built in a day.

Legend #6: The people in Iraq are glad that we are here.

The majority are.

Legend #7: We have everything under control there.

No one said we did.

Legend #8: Terrorism has already decreased due to the war on Iraq

Truth: Say what? I agree, but war or no war terrorsim would have increased anyways

Legend #9: We will make the Middle East more stable.

Truth: The middle east will never be as stable as america.

Legend #10: The Iraq is a place full of terrorists

Truth: Yes, now it is. and always has been.

You see people like you have no idea whats going on over there. Oh yeah you watch the news and you all the sudden know more huh? i have done my time over there so go do yours then talk.
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The next time the shuttle lands, lets all get dressed up in ape suits and charge at the astronaughts yelling and ranting. That way they can try to figure out where they took a wrong turn.

Ok...There's room for arguement on either way on most of what you said. Though I think you are dead wrong on #5. We may leave with a democracy set in place...but it will be quickly voted out or removed from power by either a new dictator or in favor of a religious state.

It is a mistake Americans make when they think everyone in the world will rush to embrace democracy. It is alien to these people. They feel much more secure with a strong man or (their religious leaders) in power.

You say you were there. I'm curious...In what capacity?

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

In what capacity....well let me tell you i am an enlisted soldeir and i was there is a capacity i was there when it all started and did patrols in town around bahgdad and other places i have talked to a vast amount of iraqi people that love us, from grown men, to children and women.

And yes wiht due time i believe there will be an established demcracy over there. everyone said the same thing about russia as well.
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The next time the shuttle lands, lets all get dressed up in ape suits and charge at the astronaughts yelling and ranting. That way they can try to figure out where they took a wrong turn.

So were you a Marine or Army...a specialist or a grunt? From the way you write, you were not an officer. To be fair I was Qm attached to the USS Holland AS-32 I served in the Med from 1970-72

I never served there...Just Spain and Morocco where I did 2 years. But from my experience with Moslems (and I ran into plenty) as well looking at history, I will have to disagree with your optimism. The Moslem culture does not favor democracy.

No matter how nice you thought they were to you at street level, they will ultimately, follow a strong leader of their own over a Christian liberator. They are a very religious people as you should know from being around them. They will do what their mullahs tell them. That is their nature.

The Koran teaches them to follow and obey-not to question...to destroy infidels, especially ones who occupy their country. (That is us).

Russia (as opposed to most of the rest of the old Soviet Union) was and is a Christian country. That is an entirely different culture than the Moslems which they also fought.

Look at what happened when the Soviet Union split up. In several places the age old Christian vs Moslem wars came back. Along with ethnic cleansing. Two very different cultures...Not a good comparison.

As a soldier, you were taught in boot camp the value of history's lessons. I know this because I was taught that in basic training. Read the history of the region and you will understand what I am trying to point out.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

I am in the Air Force and i was attatched to a coalition unit, with sapnish, army, marine, latvian etc. no i am not an officer, and i dont plan to be.

as far as the religion goes wow, alot of the Iraqis were, are you ready?, CHRISTIAN, we opened a numerous amount of christian churches and schools. Granted most of my time was spent in northern iraq were i guess it isnt as hostile...oh wait it was never mind. all i am stating is the facts from when i was over there. Well the whole point is not to establish christianity in the middle east but to give the people there basic human rights, choice, religion etc. if they choose to follow the shiites, mullahs or whomever they can, the whole point is so they dont get killed for talking down to someone we are making that place better for the people there and a few of them dot like it cause they dont have the free access tor ape rooms, and all that other stuff they did when saddam was in power.
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The next time the shuttle lands, lets all get dressed up in ape suits and charge at the astronaughts yelling and ranting. That way they can try to figure out where they took a wrong turn.

This begins to make sense. If you spent your time mainly in Northern Iraq aiding Christian Iraqis, no wonder they were friendly. Once again the difference between Christain and Moslem.

I will admit though, this is the first time I have ever conversed with an Air Force enlisted man who called himself a "soldier". Usually they respond with their rate and/or specialty.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

you can say what you want but the same thing applies to bahgdad, Najf, Tikrit, and Ballad. Yes there are some horrible places that the people didnt like us, but hey we have a job to do and thats what we are doing.

froggy
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The next time the shuttle lands, lets all get dressed up in ape suits and charge at the astronaughts yelling and ranting. That way they can try to figure out where they took a wrong turn.

No one said that you didn't have "a job to do"...My nephew served and saw combat there.

What is questioned here is the validity of that job.

Our troops had a "job to do" in Viet nam. it still to this day doesn"t justify what turned out to be a horrible mistake.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

To give people a better oppurtunity to live. that was the job and thats what we are doing. i dotn support all the reasons for going to war or the poeple that sent us there but i support my country and my brothers at arms. i also support a better way of life for all mankind...
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The next time the shuttle lands, lets all get dressed up in ape suits and charge at the astronaughts yelling and ranting. That way they can try to figure out where they took a wrong turn.

Thats what I and my comrades believed too.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

For the record. The varios sects of Christianity comprise about 3% of the population of Iraq.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."