Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I live in Northeast Texas and came across this snake last night. It has no fangs and is very agressive. I was thinking it may be an Eastern Rat(but I'm probably way off). Anyone know for sure what it is?

photos

Looks like a water snake though from the pics I'm not sure which one. The attitude matches most water snakes I've caught as well. I found this site which may help you in your identification since it has range maps.
http://www.zo.utexas.edu/research/txherps/snakes/

Lora

Thanks, It sounds like its a (Nerodia cyclopion)
Mississippi Green Water Snake but I found a Texas Rat Snake that looks similar as well.
Texas Rat Snake

When ever I pick him up he stinks real bad and I can still smell it after I wash my hands!

Looks like a N. sipedon to me, but they don't occur there. Closest to that would be N. fasciata confluens, the broad-banded watersnake, but I'm not sure if older adults have a faded pattern or not.

~~Greg~~

Not Northern, this snakes belly is plain, where a northern and broad banded both have strongly marked bellies. I believe it to be a Yellow bellied water snake. Nerodia erythrogaster flavigaster.
Brian

>>Looks like a N. sipedon to me, but they don't occur there. Closest to that would be N. fasciata confluens, the broad-banded watersnake, but I'm not sure if older adults have a faded pattern or not.
>>
>> ~~Greg~~
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1.0 Corn snake (KY locale)
1.0 Black rat snake (KY locale)
1.0 Albino Black rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.0 Everglades rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
0.1 Yellow rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.1 California king snake (Coastal phase)
1.0 Prairie king snake (KY locale)
0.1 Black king snake (KY locale)

Good luck and Happy Herping
Brian

Its not a cyclopion either. take a look at this link and see what the belly looks like. It is also strongly marked.
Yours you have pictured is more than likely a yellow belly water snake.

mississippi green water snake

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1.0 Corn snake (KY locale)
1.0 Black rat snake (KY locale)
1.0 Albino Black rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.0 Everglades rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
0.1 Yellow rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.1 California king snake (Coastal phase)
1.0 Prairie king snake (KY locale)
0.1 Black king snake (KY locale)

Good luck and Happy Herping
Brian

with flavigaster. Def. not cyclopion or any fasciata. It could be an intergrade as I have seen them quite often, though (what appear) to the dark marks only on the edges of the ventral scales would probably mean yellowbelly. Kind of hard to tell without seeing the snake though. Either way, it is def. Nerodia erythrogaster.
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Andy Maddox
AIM: SurfAndSkimTx04
MSN: Poloboy32486@hotmail.com
Yahoo:surfandskimtx04
Houston Herp Key
The Reptizone

Burgundy baby, With your blue eyed soul, You play the hits and I'm on that roll, Capricorn sister, Freddie Mercury, Jupiter Child cry

I would have to say it is a yellow bellied water snake - Nerodia erythrogaster flavigaster. There are 3 that range that part of texas, the yellow bellied, diamond back and blotched. The one you have pictured looks more like a yellow bellied than any of the other 2.

Do a search on the web and compare the pics, bet thats what it is.

Also, the heat rock you have in the cage with the snake is very dangerous. They can overheat and cause severe burns to a snake, I would pull it out and use under tank heat. The best thing to do with a heat rock is to cut the electric cord off of it and let the snake use it as a rub rock!!!

I wish pet stores would stop selling them.
Brian
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1.0 Corn snake (KY locale)
1.0 Black rat snake (KY locale)
1.0 Albino Black rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.0 Everglades rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
0.1 Yellow rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.1 California king snake (Coastal phase)
1.0 Prairie king snake (KY locale)
0.1 Black king snake (KY locale)

Good luck and Happy Herping
Brian

Once again the ID of this snake greatly depends on the ventral pattern, or lack there of. The color is off on your picture which makes the identification of erthrogaster (the most likely suspect)questionable.

I see nowhere here a clear description of the belly. Is there any blotching (red, orange, or brown)? Or is there a (mid body) orange streak running down the center of the belly?

What county was it found in?

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

Frank
did you go to the picture site this guy has? There are a couple of shots of the belly. The belly in the pictures is lacking any markings. The color is not that great, and just do to the range and lack of markings on the belly is why I think it may be a yellow belly. If far enough west it could also be Nerodia erythrogaster transversa - plainbelly, or even an intergrade of transversa X flavigaster.
Brian

>>Once again the ID of this snake greatly depends on the ventral pattern, or lack there of. The color is off on your picture which makes the identification of erthrogaster (the most likely suspect)questionable.
>>
>>I see nowhere here a clear description of the belly. Is there any blotching (red, orange, or brown)? Or is there a (mid body) orange streak running down the center of the belly?
>>
>>What county was it found in?
>>
>>Frank
>>-----
>>"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."
-----

1.0 Corn snake (KY locale)
1.0 Black rat snake (KY locale)
1.0 Albino Black rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.0 Everglades rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
0.1 Yellow rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.1 California king snake (Coastal phase)
1.0 Prairie king snake (KY locale)
0.1 Black king snake (KY locale)

Good luck and Happy Herping
Brian

Here is the link to the other pics. One good belly shot, but the color is not that good.

http://snakephotos.50megs.com/photo.html
Water snake pics

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1.0 Corn snake (KY locale)
1.0 Black rat snake (KY locale)
1.0 Albino Black rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.0 Everglades rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
0.1 Yellow rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.1 California king snake (Coastal phase)
1.0 Prairie king snake (KY locale)
0.1 Black king snake (KY locale)

Good luck and Happy Herping
Brian

Thanks HOTSHOT

For some reason, I can't pull up all the pictures( just the first three) From what you describe I am inclined to beleave that it is an intergrade between flavigaster and transversa. That would explain the paler belly.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

Without any clear shots of the belly.
Brian

>>Thanks HOTSHOT
>>
>>For some reason, I can't pull up all the pictures( just the first three) From what you describe I am inclined to beleave that it is an intergrade between flavigaster and transversa. That would explain the paler belly.
>>
>>Frank
>>-----
>>"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."
-----

1.0 Corn snake (KY locale)
1.0 Black rat snake (KY locale)
1.0 Albino Black rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.0 Everglades rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
0.1 Yellow rat snake (Dwight Good stock)
1.1 California king snake (Coastal phase)
1.0 Prairie king snake (KY locale)
0.1 Black king snake (KY locale)

Good luck and Happy Herping
Brian

the color of photo is correct. It's dirty white, no other colors on belly, and no pattern. It was found in camp county, under an old scrap piece of carpet.

Ok...that is a bit to the East of the actual contact line on my map but still a pretty safe bet on the intergrade.

I will stick by the ID I mentioned above: erthrogaster f & t.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."