Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Help,

I don't know what to do. Today I went into a local pet store and they had all of their chameleons in glass. They had two big male Veileds, each in their own 20 gallon tank!!! They were way too big for those tanks. Both of them looked pretty dark too. And one looked like it is starting to develope MBD. Neither one of them had a UVB light and neither one had any green in their tanks. I don't know what to do.

Is this abuse? Can they get in trouble for it?

Thanks,

Matt
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2.9 SHTC Leopard Geckos
0.0.4 and counting SHTC Leopard Geckos
0.1 Tangerine Albinos
1.2 Veiled Chameleons
1.1 Arizona Mt. Kings

Definately abuse. The best thing to do is just tell the manager or somebody. That's all you can do, really. There's a PetSmart down the street from that houses 1 male and 2 female jacksons in a 10 gallon glass tank with a water dish and fake plants and vines. They also always have at least 15 HUGE crickets roaming around at all times. I've repeatedly told management about it, but they don't want to change anything because they paid so much for this lame foam "rock fature" that houses a bunch of reptiles in the worst conditions. Sometimes I feel like buying them from there and then giving them to the veterinary clinic I go to as "rescued animals" But all that'll do get them more shipments of chameleons that'll suffer. And I don't have enough money to keep buying chameleons!

It sucks, but there's nothing you can really do. THe corporate man is just too powerful. Damn the man.

Don't get me started on PetCo . . .

I ran into the same thing over a bearded dragon. I talked with the manager and she didn't know squat about them and it was obvious that she wasn't going to really listen to me so i called the local S P C A, I wasn't sure whether they would do anything but they sent someone out there to check things out and I called the SPCA back the next day to find out what had been done. It may have helped a little and the last time I checked on him he was still alive (although I feel under less the optimum circumstances) but at least I did SOMETHING which gave me a little piece of mind. It was very hard not to just buy the poor little thing but I got advice from the bearded dragon forum that if i did that then i'm just supporting them and they will continue to do the same thing cuz they figure someone will come along and still buy the lizard. Hope this helps, sorry its kinda long.L.
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0.0.1 Bearded Dragon (Eddie)
2.0.0 Dogs (Black German Shepherd-Nicholas, Black Lab-Cooper)
1.1.0 Budgies (Kia and Simon)
0.0.1 ?Fiddler Crab (Crusty)
0.0.25 Various Fishies (Freshwater)
2.1.0 Hubby and kids (Boy and a Girl)

One thing that really gets me going is abused or neglected animals in a pet store. If these guys can't put in the resources to properly house and care for an animal while in their care, then they really have no business doing business! But I digress.
What to do: just like the other person suggested, call the local humane society, SCPA, better business bureau, animal control, local newspaper. Please don't sit on your hands on these issues. Please speak up for the pets, they have no voice.
I'll be 100% honest here. I don't like PeTA one bit! If you knew what their ulterior motives were (the 100% banning of ALL animal use by humans, ie outlawing ALL pets), and how they go about twisting the public opinion about them.... well, that being said, contact PeTA if you're not getting anywhere. Maybe they can give you some ideas on what to do to make the pet store owner to listen to you and change their husbandry practices.
Getting off my soapbox now.
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Victor Gomez
gomezvi.tripod.com/sdchamkeepers/
gomezvi@yahoo.com

I agree about PETA. They are unrealistic nut-cases.

Maybe you should print out some info (care sheet) and take it to the store manager, along with telling them they are being cruel and killing their animals.

From a store's point of view, they don't care at all. A Chameleon isn't any different than a bottle of dog shampoo. It's product, to be sold, to anyone with green money. If they sell sick Chams, they don't care. If the Chams die, they don't care. It's about MONEY to them, period. There is really nothing you can do.

Maybe you can print out some flyers about what they are doing and pass them out on the sidewalk out front until they run you off. That could be fun! I commend you for wanting to do something.

yeah, i love how all these pet stores have so many rules about keeping chams, yet they dont follow any of them. I have two local stores which sell chams. One is awesome, and they really take good care of there chams, and all their pets. As for the other store, it is so sloppy. I just want to break in and release all their animals. They have about 5-6 differnt kinds of chameleons. They usually have a panther, veiled, mellers, flapneck, graceful and some others. They all get an equal sized cage. The meller's is in an 18x18x18 enclosure, all wood, not even a screen top. How come they tell you they need sfreen, but use wood themsleves. They also say not to feed them large crickets till they are big eneough, yet i see over 1 inch crickets in with 3 month veileds. The stores name is Pets Plus in Lockport, NY. Its not related to the chain stores called pets plus, and they suck. I have seen at least 10 dead animals there, mainly gecko's and frogs, but I did see a dead 400$ turtle once, and it stayed in the cage for at least 4 days. SLOPPY< SLOPPY< SLOPPY
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1.0 Ambanja Panther
1.1 Leopard Gecko's

I too have been to this pet store (pets plus) in lockport seeing that I live 30 minutes away from them. I used to go to thier shop a lot when I was younger and back then thier staff was very knowledgable and actually cared about thier animals. The animals seemed healthy back then. Now things have changed and I have become very upset with the care thier animals now recieve. Still they are no wheres near as bad as the petsmarts in the area housing veilds and jacksons together and feeding the young vields adult crix which are far to big for them. By they way which store also sells the chams that you say takes very good care of them?

Markheims takes great care of their pets. They alwasy have a very knowledgable staff, and they have a sweet Ambanja Male/Female. They also have oustalets right now and a veiled. They have a wide selection of feeders as well as everything else you need to care for your pet. Sometimes when i go there the girl working wil take the panther out and let me hold him. he is huge, and has some nice colors. Its just too bad he isn't for sale.
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1.0 Ambanja Panther
1.1 Leopard Gecko's

Hi there:

I go to Pets Plus often. I have purchased green snakes, caecilians (Dermophis Occidentalis), a ribbon snake, a corn snake and an Axolotl there. I agree with you every bit. Its a pretty wierd place, isn't it? They house horned frogs together, and my caecilians were in with an AMERICAN BULLFROG!!! They sell fiber-optic rotating lights and statues and stuff. Wierd abstract cage supplies with useless platforms and things. There are also those wierd dinosaur heads on the wall.
But what upset me most, is nearby the ribbon snake cage, have you seen those really tiny cages? I have never once seen anything in them, but they are about 3 inches long, really dark, and full with wood chips. They are built into the wall in a little row. Do you know the cages I mean?
Of course the alligator died, and now there's a snapper in there that can't even turn around! Please respond. Thank you.

DAVE

here is a link to listing by state (you have to scroll down for listings)

also humane society, spca, etc.
herp societies

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0.1 veiled - Luna
0.2 green anoles Jaida & Jetta
0.1 brown anole - Jamaica the j sisters were sent to freedom last month
0.2 house geckos - Gaia & Tia (MIA
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Líta

Today or tomorrow I'm going into that pet store to talk to the owner. I'm going to tell him he needs to change his husbandry or I will contact the proper authorities. I also live on a college campus that really cares about animals and the environment. If I made a flyer about this, my school would go nuts.

Thanks everyone,

Matt
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2.9 SHTC Leopard Geckos
0.0.4 and counting SHTC Leopard Geckos
0.1 Tangerine Albinos
1.2 Veiled Chameleons
1.1 Arizona Mt. Kings

Hi Matt,

when you approach him/her try to stay as cool-headed as you can. He/she will be a lot more apt to listen if you present in a friendly rather than threatening way. Sort of feel him out. if he's a jerk about it- then do everything you can to assure the health of the animals.

Someone suggested bringing in a care sheet and I think that is a good idea. Go to AdCham.com, and ChamnNews, etc. for good sheets.

Keep us posted on your success!

lele
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0.1 veiled - Luna
0.2 green anoles Jaida & Jetta
0.1 brown anole - Jamaica the j sisters were sent to freedom last month
0.2 house geckos - Gaia & Tia (MIA
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Líta