Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I am considering adding a second female to my Timor pair, who have been together for over a year now. I'd like to get some opinions on the subject. The cage I have my pair in is 6' tall by 4' wide by 20" deep, with multiple shelves and climbing branches, and about 12 inches of cypress mulch on the bottom. Thanks very much!

If it was my collection, I personally would not introduce another female into the mix, especially after having the existing pair together for a while, and they have given you eggs.. I am sure several people on this site can attest that once you add a new individual into an established 'social' group, it throws off the balance, and their behaviors then change.. If you are having success with your timors as is, by this I mean, they are healthy, robust, and reproducing, I wouldn't go adding another female or another captive for that matter.. Perhaps you might be able to introduce a new female if you are putting the new group into a brand new, cage, for then, the original pair would be in a new place, and would have to get used to their new surroundings again, along with their new 'cagemate'. They would all have a better chance at acclimating to one another in this manner, as opposed to introducing a new animal into their existing territory..

But then again, this will certainly cause stress on your established pair.... It's just my opinion, but I would advise you not to... Take it easy, best of luck to you with them eggs...

bob

That's what I appreciate, an honest opinion from an established source, whether I like what I'm hearing or not. I admit I do believe that monitors are social, at least to a certain degree, and what you say makes sense. Thanks for the advice!

This exact question was recently asked by Robert on Varanus.net. I responded with this;

"About trios, groups etc. Successfully breeding monitors is all about percentages. You try to keep the percentages in your favor. The higher the better. (there is no such thing as 100%)

If you start with hatchlings and raise them together, the percentage of success is high. If you start with wild caughts, the percentage of success is low. If you start with adults of captive hatched its between that. (just examples)

Its all about eliminating problems and increasing percentages.

Now, about your(roberts and yours) question, the same applies. You can add to the percentages by attempting to breed a sexual pair. When you add more individuals to the mix, you are lowering the percentage of success(complicating things).(even if you know what your doing)

Now in your(roberts) case, you are asking if you should stack obstacles that lower your percentage of success on top of each other. Well I imagine the answer is, if thats what you want to do.

Its kinda like telling me, you have a bad hand, and broken leg and you want to know if you should grease the flagpole before you climb it. Then mention you have never climbed a flagpole before. Well, I guess you could grease it, but why? Good luck"

Back to you Bob. Forgive me if I am wrong, but your new to this, so why complicated it? Also, you seem to want to do with others do, start at the top and work down. I would imagine a base education learned from generations of breeding monitors would allow you to be better prepared to deal with WC's.

I hear your doing that
(CB's) now. But you have not learned yet. You know in schools you have to complete a prerequisite(sp)class and pass it, to advance to another class. I would imagine without the understanding of the basics, that identifying advanced behaviors and characteristics COULD be difficult.

Many people(the inexperienced) Think that one countries monitors are different and may be harder then another countries monitors. Of course I do not. But may I add, with the shy monitors from any country, you have to predict what behaviors and sequences, they are doing, not see them, as you would in monitors that are not so shy.

Either case, you still must understand the sequences and rythums of monitors seasonal and lifecycles. Things like being able to identify what your seeing. You know like what a female is from a male, or a cycling female(pre-mature ovum)(large internal fat bodies) or what a female that has dropped developed ovum(large ovum, small fat bodies) looks like. Or what a female with eggs looks like(post water loss). Or even simplier things like what a successful male looks like compared to a male with under developed gonads.

Like the case of your female Bluetree. I think she is developing internal fat bobies, which is a prelude to mature ovum. This is not to be cofused with a gravid female. A gravid female has developed eggs inside her.

So yes, If you want to complicate things before you understand what you are complicating, go for it. Its a free country(sort of) Cheers FR

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I confused Phil with Bob. whata dork I am. Work it out amoungst yourselfs, thanks

LMAO!!! Thanks for the laugh Frank, I needed that.

What do you mean "I went senile..."??? You are senile you old goat! At least you're not anti-social though!!!

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