Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I finally decided after looking for a good long while at various snakes, and decided on a female licorice stripe black rat snake. She's about 9 months old. I've named her Lola, and if I get a male he's going to be Frankie. (After the Jimmy Buffett song.) He's going to wait a couple weeks before shipping so I can get the tank set up and be ready for arrival.

This is what I have planned so far:

29 gallon tank, wire mesh lid with 4 clips (do I need 2 pkgs? 4/pkg)

i'm going to construct a 9 inch cube out of hardware cloth, no bottom, sides and top covered in bamboo or astroturf, with a hole in the side for a hiding spot. or should i just get one of those plastic bottomless hiding things from the pet shop for $5?

Aspen or cypress chips. Any personal pref?

I was planning on putting a heating pad under the tank, or an undertank heater...whichever is cheaper. any comments on this?

A rock under a 75 watt basking light

regular 24" flourescent strip light...do I need a UV-B?

Is there anything i'm forgetting? Please let me know! thanks!

I have a picture of her posted on my website,

http://students.uwf.edu/crt4/lola.jpg

(how do you post pictures in this forum?)

oh and he says shes been eating f/t fuzzy mice, or live rat pups, however turns her nose at live fuzzy mice. lol. which is good for me, my apartment says no live mice. How do I know how often/how much to feed her? I always have been under the impression one animal a week, but reading through some posts i've seen people feeding multiple mice in one feeding...how do I know what to feed her? Thanks.

29 gallon should be plenty of space for the snake. You'll need to packs of lid clamps as I have only ever seen them come with two in a pack.

I prefer using Apspen bedding. It packs down real easy and rat snakes low to burrow tunnels in it.

If you use an under tank heater there is really no reason to get a basking bulb as you will get higher temps with both! You can use one or the other. Some people prefer under tank heaters and some prefer the clamp lights with day-glo bulbs or basking bulbs. I use a basking bulb for my yellow rat snake since rat snakes do not require UV lighting. Some owners of rat snakes even suggest that UV lighting can be bad for the snake.I have no personal knowledge of that so I can not be sure but I have had my snake since April of last year and I never once used a UV light.

If you do use both a basking light AND undertank heater make sure the temp does not rise above 86 degrees on the warm side of the tank. You can use the basking light during the day as this will definately raise the temp in the tank. I have my yellow AND king snake in 29 gallon tanks and use 50 watt bulbs and substain a temp of 83-85 degrees on the warm side and a temp of around 77 on the other. Depending on the temp of your house would depend on the watt light you would use. At night time the under tank heater would be perfect or you can use a night-glo bulb with a lesser wattage to lower the night time temps.The problem with bulbs are you will need to replace them after they burn out of course. I usually get about 800 hours of usage per light bulb,sometimes more or less.

I would recommend atleast two hide spots in the enclosure.One on the warm side and one on the cool side. Young rat snakes can be skittish and you don't want to make the snake pick between getting warm of feeling secure so one on each side is a very good idea.

Just make sure you have a water dish of course!

You wont need that flourescent strip light either!

Sorry,left out feeding! That all depends on the snake really. I would suggest 2 fuzzies mice every 5-7 days and move up to hoppers/adult mice when the snake gets older.No more then 2-3 per sitting until the snake is a adult. Once he reaches adult hood he should be fed one proper size mouse/rat every 7-10 days.You could always feed the snake a few hoppers when he is an adult also instead of an adult mouse.Depending if you are feeding live rodents or prekilled. Adult mice can fight back!
My yellow rat is a picky eatter and does not eat prekilled mice. This came from the breeder who feeds all his snakes live mice.Lucky my kingsnake will eat either or since kings are great responsive eatters.Since your snake eats prekilled I would stick with that unless you want to see your snake constrict and kill the mice himself.

He is most likely feeding it newborn or 3 day old rat pups.Rat pups can be rather big and fat after 7 days old!

I think you'll be happy with your new snake- and lola is a great name Black rats of any type are pretty robust snakes and most calm down with regular handling. Hatchlings and juveniles can be a little spastic but once they get some size on them they generally calm down. Sullman answered most of your questions so I'll just hit a couple high points. I agree that just using some type of under tank heating is easiest. You may want to invest in a good digital thermometer with a probe (not the stick on kind from the pet store) to check your temps over the hot spot. You can pick them up for 10-15 bucks at places like Wallmart or Radioshack. I've bought a few on-line for reasonable prices. My favorite is a little tempgun from Proexotics that allows me to spot check temps anywhere in the cage.

As for hides- for a small snake I just go to the dollar store or Big lots and get cheap tupperware and cut an appropriate sized hole in the lid. You can always add moist moss (or paper towels)inside to create a damp hide during shedding and they are super easy to clean up. Another thing I like about using the tupperware type hides, is they come in any size you might need, so you can increase the size when the snake out grows them. My snakes seem to prefer a hide that they can touch all sides in- so smaller is better.

For feeding- feed what the breeder is currently feeding the snake and as she grows increase either the number of items or the prey size. You want to see a lump but not a huge lump after feeding. Feeding too large prey can lead to regurgitation, so better a couple of small items than one huge one. With young snakes, some people feed every 5 days or so while they're growing. I usually feed after I see the snake has passed the previous meal. Once the snake is an adult- I feed every 7-10 days (larger prey items take longer to digest). Try not to handle the snake for a couple of days after feeding so she can digest her meal with out stress.

Good luck with your snake and post some pics when you can.
Lora

...And good advice from all. Black rats are awesome animals, and the licorice stick is beautiful. Pay close attention to joliff's posts on the subject...He has tons of experience with them. Also, as stated, they ARE super robust snakes and should thrive even if you stray outside the "exact" parameters of temp, etc a little bit. When your snake matures, you may decide on a larger cage, but that decision is a ways off. The above advice on not handling the snake for 2-3 days after a meal is important, especially when the snake is new and you want to pick it up all the time. Let it settle in for a few days before feeding, and try not to handle at all until it has fed a couple of times in its new home. Black rats tend to be good feeders, however, so you shouldn't have much trouble. I did not quite understand your question about where the snake will be and if you should "take it in" or if it was OK to wait. You may want to clarify, or is it just a matter of whose house it is living at right now? Good luck, and, again, good choice! Duffy

No 75 watt bulbs!! Will prob. be too hot for a 29 gallon tank - especially in the summer. Buy the indoor/outdoor thermometer (the one w/ the sensor on a cord) from wallyworld (lawn & garden section) for $10. It will give you an exact surface temp. reading for your hot spot. Lower the wattage of the bulb to decrease temps. & increase to raise temps. I like to use a coloured bulb (red, blue, etc.) to decrease the blinding brightness of a white bulb. Hide spot on each side (cool & warm) of the cage. Feed one appropriate sized meal once to twice a week.

Well, would there be any negative to using a flourescent strip light? I just want it so I can see her better. I already have a 50 watt basking bulb, that I used on my turtles before they died. The only things i'll have to buy are the guts, including an undertank heater, and the cover.

Do the snakes like to lay out in the sun (basking light)? I know my turtles sure did, lol. That's why I was kind of planning on using both. Also, i've heard bad things about rock heaters. I guess I should totally cut out the idea of getting one of those?

I don't really want to use a tupperware container...I want it to look a little nicer. I don't mind spending $5 for a hideaway hutch for her. I was also wondering, do they like to climb, like up on branches and such? If so I was going to put in some driftwood that I can sterilize.

I've also heard more when I was first interested in getting a snake than recently, taking it to the vet as soon as I get it to check for parasites? Recently I havent been told that...is it just because it should be common knowledge?

When she's shipped she's going to my aunt and uncle's house, who love snakes...I live with my mom and g'ma, and my g'ma is deathly afraid of them...even to the point she can't look at a picture of one. I'll be over there every other week, so should I go on and take her in or would it be ok to wait until around the beginning of August? Or is it even necessary?

Thanks everyone for replies past and future.

-Chris

oh one other thing....Heating pad vs undertank heater. Any differences? Which does everyone here use/prefer?

I am looking at undertank heaters. I found a repti therm and a cobra heat pad. My question on the cobra heat pad it says it keeps the temp of the pad 100 degrees. is this way too hot for a rat snake, or does it disperse more than I think? or is it no the name "cobra" but for the actual cobra snake? lol

The Cobra heat mat is a name brand (so you could use it for any snake). You are absolutely right that they do run hotter than your desired temp and any heat source will need a little tinkering to get the cage to the appropriate temp. That's where a thermometer comes in.

What you can do is when setting up the cage, put the heat mat under the tank and measure the surface temp of the area directly above the heat source, in addition to the ambient temp of the cage. You want the ambient temp to be in the 70-75 degree range (basically room temp) and the spot over the heat source to be around 80-88 degrees. If you allow for some air to circulate between the heat source and the tank bottom by raising the bottom of the tank on something like blocks, then the heat measured on the bottom of the inside of the cage will be lower than the full heat of the mat. Don't attach the heat mat, if it's one of those with the adhesive on one side, to the bottom of the cage. This just becomes a pain when you want move the cage for cleaning or reuse the heat mat on a different cage.

Different substrates will also affect how much heat gets through to where the snake will be resting. For example, with aspen shavings, the temp at the surface of the shavings will be lower than what you can measure on the surface of the glass directly over the heat source. That's great as long as your snake doesn't burrow into the shavings to the bare bottom of the tank. Same goes for astro turf or other reptile carpet, great as long as the snake doesn't (and mine always have at some point when I used reptile carpet) get under it.

You can also get a rheostat to limit the amount of power running the heat mat to reduce the temps (this takes some adjustment to find the appropriate setting since it will vary depending on your room temps). I bought digital thermostats to measure the temp and control the heat sources so at a glance I know the temp over the hot spot and that the heat source is on. But I've used the methods above for cages in the past.
Hope that didn't confuse you!
Lora