Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I few years ago I bought an albino male boa and two large female het albinos from a fairly popular breeder in the classifieds. Well I finally bred to another albino male boa and I got 19 babies all het for albino one of those hets is striped I posted the pic earlier. Well, back to the story, I called the breeder and he told me the animals came from a big name breeder. Well, eventually we made an agreement that he would give me a hold back het albino boa female, at the time I figured what the hell I am lucky to even get that. So I made arrangements and picked up the boa she is a yearling but very small I was kind of disappointed but still thinking hell atleast got this. So basically what's your opinion on this ?????

You bred a male albino to what you thought were 100% het females and got NO albinos? If they were sold to you as 100% hets I think you are entitle to more than just a holdback female...It sounds like you got ripped off...if I understood correctly. Did you get the name of the person who produced them? Contact them and find out what this guy really sold you. I would be PISSED!

Chris
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com

He did sell the animals to this person....

If you paid to get 2 het albino females (and not possible hets)then that is what you should have. You chould not settle for a baby het to replace the two ADULT "hets" you purchased. That baby isn't worth near what you would have paid for 2 adult female hets.
Now, you may choose to take the passive road and try them for one more breeding, but you should have gotten at least one albino baby from the breeding.
If you were sold adult normals for the price of adult hets...have the person you got them from make it right - NOW (perhaps he was lied to as well, but it is not your responsibility to pay for that lie)...refund all your money (return the normals) or replace them with 2 other adult hets. Or...gather your documentation, emails, pics, whatever you will need...and go to the BOI and a lawyer if need be.
I'm not normally aggressive when it comes to stuff like this, but there is a whole lot of financial difference between an adult het and a normal adult. I would not want to eat that kind of money.
Best of luck to you!!

PS - gorgeous stripe though!
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I don't think you should be satisfied with anything less than a full refund. If this person cannot make it right, I would pursue other actions.

BTW - Albino x 100% Het should net
-50% Albinos
-50% Het Albinos

Chris
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com

john, i dont even know what the deal really was , i was trusting you and what you said you bred to that het . im sorry man but we made a deal and you sighned off, you shouldnt be spreading our business all around anyway. makes for worse business . like i said you were satisfied and sighned off . plus you kept the animal and all the babys. please dont bring this to me again. lets not forget the fact that i paid full price for that animal as a het , who can i go back on---- no-one . at least you got a yearling het from my coral litter.
i got nothing. your keeping the animal ! the deal we done was fair , your having a good year . but that must be going to your head , because your sounding greedy.
NOBODY CAN COUNT ON BOAS so theres no intrest thats nuts man.
A deal is a deal , and you sure seemed satisfied when you left.

I would feel betrayed. I would like this person to come onto the forum and attach himself to that transaction. If he purchased the animals as 100% hets, he should have gotten paperwork...but so should you. He gave you that nice het...that's good and all, but he needs to go back to the original producer of the animals and try to work it out so you can both get some reclamation out of this mess.

Chris
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com

I am not quite understanding what he is saying. I am assuming he is saying that you were pleased with the original deal of getting the 2 100% het females. So, you accepted them and that was the end of it??
Ok - if one of the adult hets had died several weeks later or something, nothing could be done, but not being as represented is completely different. That you can not prove/disprove until they are bred. They have now bred and one disproved or was misrepresented.
He said they were sold to him as such. Fine and dandy. He needs to go after whomever he got them from to make things right for him. BUT, he needs to make things right by you. You are HIS customer and he must stand behind his guarantee on what he sells.
If, on the other hand, he meant you signed off and were ok with the baby you received in replacement, then you have no further grounds to dispute, as you do have the baby and the deal is over (until ist is proven/disproven)
In a perfect, honorable world, You would return the non-het (and het baby you were sent to make up for the non-het) and get a full refund for what you spent on the adult het. This way you can purchase another adult het. If you chose to accept the baby het, then the deal is finished and he is right... until the baby can be proven/unproven.
Hope this isn't even more confusing...
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i have been wrong about things before as well as others......i made it right though.
james c.
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IF YOU HAVE IT SHOW IT. IF YOU OWN IT FLAUNT IT!!

In a perfect world those would be correct percentages. But, I have had a proven, known het produce nothing but normals for 2 years before hitting the jackpot. So, while it may not be the norm, it is not unheard of for that to happen.
My assumption would be that he got messed over...but due to my experiences, I cannot say that 100%.
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it like this, my friend at robinettereptiles had his first litter of albino boas this year. a het to a hughe female albino boa. 19 albinos and i think 17 hets. WOW that rocks!! the average is 1 in 16. laura v has another point. it might take another litter??? just my 2 pennies.
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IF YOU HAVE IT SHOW IT. IF YOU OWN IT FLAUNT IT!!

the average for a het x albino isn't 1 in 16. that would mean only 6.25% were albino. the punnet square tells us 50% and 50%...and while this varies, it is usually preety close.

Chris
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com

im not thinking tonight. sorry.
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IF YOU HAVE IT SHOW IT. IF YOU OWN IT FLAUNT IT!!

np
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com

het 2 het......lol
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IF YOU HAVE IT SHOW IT. IF YOU OWN IT FLAUNT IT!!

But het to het is 1 in 4. You were thinking double het to double het. Sorry but had to say it before someone read this and got confused. Or just more confused. LOL

Chris

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IF YOU HAVE IT SHOW IT. IF YOU OWN IT FLAUNT IT!!

I have know this breeder for years and I did go soft on him because of that but now it just eating at me. I feel very robbed. I bought these as 7ft proven breeder hets in 2001 and just finally got breedings out of the two girls now one of the girls did prove to be het but this one did not. Thes were gaurunteed 100% Hets. I took your advice and I have emailed the breeder. I dont feel its his fault because he bought from a very well known breeder who supposedly bought it from another breeder.
JB

np
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com

I would expect some albino's for this. Even if you get an adult het you are still a year out before you get your next clutch! You deserve a lot more than what you paid!

Every one is always so quick to jump to think the worst of everyone else. I am assuming by the type of striped baby that it produced (which is a plus in itself!) That this boa is from Pete Khal’s line or possible bred by him? The striping on the tail is a good indication that it is from his striped albino projects and therefore still may be a Het for albino and the odds just may not have been with you.
You bought the snakes in 2001 for breeding at 7’ long, but did not get them to breed until this year. I don’t see how you can hold the dealer responsible for that. Unless you picked them up and they were only 3 feet long, at which point you should have been able to tell that right from the start. 19 babies is a fairly low number of babies for a snake that should be nearly 6 years old now, so it is not really a good indication of what the odds could have shown you. How many slugs were in the litter? The second female that you had was indeed a het, were the two of them related/siblings. Did you pay what you would normally pay for an Adult breedable het albino boa? An adult 100% het female would be nearly $3,000.00 vs. a few hundred for an adult possible het.
I think the breeder tried to do right by you by giving you one of his yearlings from his own stock. So now for the money you paid for two hets, you now have two hets that you know are 100% hets and a adult female that may or may not be het, but throws striped babies, not a bad deal and one that I think most would be happy with?
Just my thoughts on it.
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Jim Hopkins "Hoppy"
Hopkins Holesale Herps
Hopfam1@aol.com

The person invloved is doing his very best. I have not offered up any names becuase I was waiting to see if he would it seems he wants a good name in the business.
thanks to all for your support
JB