Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just read in the new Reptiles magazine that some chick feed may cause fertility problems because of herbacides and pesticides. Anyone out there doing large feeder colonies with any experience in this area.
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Bennett

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I used to do it, know others that did it long ago with no issues. He had some awesome clutch rates. Just have to get non medicated which most are not.
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Peace
Derek

Hey Bennett, just avoid the stuff with the extra hormones and chemicals. I've used laying mash in the mix for basically all my bugs, never had a problem.

Sean
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Heart Mountain Herps

This was posted by clickman awhile back. I would have posted a link but it is in the 2003 archives and takes a while to load so I just pasted the text.

Here it is:

I was reading over at the leopard gecko forum and felt that this should be posted here. It's from Marcia of Golden Gate Geckos.

"Forgive the second post on this subject, but I felt it was important and worth posting in it's own thread. There is nothing worse than watching something you care for waste away and die without knowing what is wrong or how to help.

As some of you may remember, a few years ago I lost 17 Leopard Geckos over a period of about 6 months to an "unknown" cause, and had many more that got sick. As it turned out, I had to get Dr. Frederic L. Frye (world's most renowned Reptile Pathologist) to help me with the last of 5 necropsies I had done to get to the bottom of the problem.

As it turned out, my geckos were sick and dying from Hepatic Lipidosis, or fatty liver disease, which was caused from Mycotoxic poisoning from ingesting crickets that were fed on moldy corn-based food. When cricket feed is allowed to get wet and warm, it develops a mold that produces Aflatoxins... more specifically Aspergilus flavus, or B1. This substance is poison, but does not harm the crickets. When the geckos eat the toxic crickets, over a period of time their livers begin to fail from trying to filter out the poison and they will die a slow and agonizing death. Once I knew what the problem was and discontinued using the poison crickets, I was able to save about 10 other geckos that were suffering.

Since many of the cricket growers are in the southern states where it is hot and humid, and they use chicken mash as feed for the crix, it is an ideal environment for mold to develop on the food. I went public on this when I was going through it, and the cricket supplier tried to sue me for making "defamatory" remarks. When I sent all the patholgy reports and documentation to his attorneys, the case was dropped.

Recently, I had a problem with bacterial infections in several of my geckos. Nothing showed up on the comventional fecal tests, but when I submitted a stool sample to a lab for a culture, it showed bacteria was the problem. Out of curiosity, I sent in about a half-dozen live crickets right out of the shipping box to the same lab, and guess what? They were LOADED with 4 strains of gram negative bacteria and 1 strain of gram positive... all of the type that would cause severe sickness in my Leos. Fortunately, all of my sick geckos repsonded very well with Baytril, and I stopped using that cricket vendor.

So now what? There MUST be a cricket supplier out there that is aware of these potentially lethal problems and gives a 'you-know-what' about the quality of the feeders they are supplying. I certainly can't afford to take crickets in for lab testing every time I get a shipment, and I don't know if there is a similar problem with mealworms. I think that if everyone who feeds their animals crickets should really lean on the suppliers and become aware of the issue. This is a very good argument for feeding your crickets fresh produce and never allowing your commercial cricket food to become wet.

Thanks for letting me 'rant'...."
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Rob Talkington

I have noticed a problem with the corn when it gets wet. I keep all my crickets and superworms in a lidless container to keep humidy levels low. They are also kept in my basement where temps rarely get over 75. I do provide the crickets with a light to provide a slightly higher temp for their tub. That post i kind of scary though. Corn could easily be removed from the cricket diet but I wonder if there is a similar impact with the supers?

Mike
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If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you are reading it in English, thank a soldier.

it is a scary post, however just don't let your mash get wet. not that hard to do.
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Peace
Derek

I have heard that before and it is scarry, there is also a halucenogenic (sp??) mold that will grow on it that you probably don't want your beardies eating. I don't have to really worry about it where I am, no humidity (or practically none) but if you're in a real wet area it may be a concern. For most people as long as you don't get it wet you'll be fine. I keep my food on one side of the cage, water on the other, and housing in between and have never had a problem with mold.

Sean
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Heart Mountain Herps

LOL! Before you know it you'll see hippies selling corn mash on the side of the road!! "Whoa, dude! Did you see that huge corncob with the pretty colors talking to the tree?"
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Rob Talkington

ya, it's actually an ergot. very similar properties and effects as lsd but wouldn't recomend eating a handfull of the stuff YUCK!!!.

Sean
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Heart Mountain Herps

Cheri told me about it but I never read the original post. Thanks.
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Bennett

www.beardiedragon.com
Win a FREE Florida Orange Beardie
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>>Cheri told me about it but I never read the original post. Thanks.
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>>Bennett
>>
>>
>>www.beardiedragon.com
>>Win a FREE Florida Orange Beardie
>>www.beardiedragon.com/pages/Main/specials.html
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Rob Talkington

I use chicken mash as bedding in my superworm colonies and have for years. I have also used it in my crickets diet for years. I make sure I buy the kind with no hormones added like Sean mentioned. I have noticed zero problems with fertility. Most fertilty problems I have experienced have been associated with improper brumation.

Mike
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If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you are reading it in English, thank a soldier.