Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Thought this would be an interesting idea, do you think people would use it if rates were reasonable?
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0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons
0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons (on breeding loan)
0.1 Sub-adult
1.0 Normal ball python
1.1 Bell Line Pastel Ball pythons
1.0 Adult Het Albino Ball Python
1.0 Het Pied Ball Python
1.0 Het Carmel Ball Python
1.0 66% Het pied Ball python
0.2 50% Het albino Ball Pythons

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Edited on June 28, 2004 at 15:30:13 by phwyvern.

Because I was just thinking the same thing last night. I was thinking based on credit rating and financial situation why wouldn't there be a company that would give loans for high end morphs. If someone didn't pay it would reflect on their credit or you could send the repo man to get the snake?? lol..

why not email me and compare notes?

rsaunders99999 @ yahoo.com (no spaces)
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0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons
0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons (on breeding loan)
0.1 Sub-adult
1.0 Normal ball python
1.1 Bell Line Pastel Ball pythons
1.0 Adult Het Albino Ball Python
1.0 Het Pied Ball Python
1.0 Het Carmel Ball Python
1.0 66% Het pied Ball python
0.2 50% Het albino Ball Pythons

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Removed advertising from signature.

Edited on June 28, 2004 at 15:30:43 by phwyvern.

You know you pay cash for all your toys!
Right?
Some breeder will let you pay for animal with payment plans. I doubt if you would get your animal till it is paid off.
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RicK @ BbI

Ball Boutique,Inc.
The home of the singing snakes!

What I am referring to is much like a car loan or something of the like. The breeder gets their $$ and the buyer gets their snake and a payment plan.

I am sure there are other issues such as credit score, collateral (if needed), etc. Also would be another option to those who don't own a home and can't do a home equity loan.
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0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons
0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons (on breeding loan)
0.1 Sub-adult
1.0 Normal ball python
1.1 Bell Line Pastel Ball pythons
1.0 Adult Het Albino Ball Python
1.0 Het Pied Ball Python
1.0 Het Carmel Ball Python
1.0 66% Het pied Ball python
0.2 50% Het albino Ball Pythons

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Removed advertising from signature.

Edited on June 28, 2004 at 15:31:40 by phwyvern.

It is called a bank/credit union in legal terms or loan sharking in not so legal terms.

Matt

loans out for a snake without some kind of collateral?

The same why you go about a home loan, car loan, or school loan I would imagine.

np

it's called a home equity line of credit. =)

ahhh the refreshing neverending sarcasim that comes with a totally legitimate, honest question....

I realize that those are very possible. I am considering the average Joe who may not already own their home, or does not have equity in their home to make it happen.
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0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons
0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons (on breeding loan)
0.1 Sub-adult
1.0 Normal ball python
1.1 Bell Line Pastel Ball pythons
1.0 Adult Het Albino Ball Python
1.0 Het Pied Ball Python
1.0 Het Carmel Ball Python
1.0 66% Het pied Ball python
0.2 50% Het albino Ball Pythons

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Removed advertising from signature.

Edited on June 28, 2004 at 15:34:09 by phwyvern.

Since the purchase of all high end morphs has to be considered a business expense I would suggest developing a solid business plan and taking it to a bank or credit union and try to get a small business loan. The only problem is the 2-3 years that you will be required to make payments on your loan while you are waiting for your snakes to mature. I am sure if you go to a financial institute with a solid pplan and a good credit history they will be willing to work something out. I unfortunately have horrendous credit so this is out of the question for myself. Todd

And be saving for a house....

First off, let me say if you have to finance a ball python morph u should really look into getting a cheaper morph or sticking with normals....Secondly, no company would do this because it is too high risk and no one would want to pay the premiums and interest rate on a loan of this type....Let me illustrate...Have you tried to get your $20k dollar collection insured by your homeowners insurance?? The rates aren't very low...There are too many variables to take in count when a company would consider financing just snakes...Husbandry and market value..If you finance a $15k spider male right now at a rate of just say 7% interest over 4 yrs. that $15k snake will cost you $16,500.00 tax...Now what about next season if the spider market drops and spider males are $10k.....Since u r making payments you probably owe more than this on your $16,500 spider so what is there preventing you from letting your snake get repo'd and buying a male this season for $10k becuase you are going to save money.......Also the interest rate would probably be alot high than 7%...U ever buy a new car? If you go out and by a $20k new car u can get a 5 yr. loan with a rate of around 2% if u r approved, now if you go out and buy a $20k used car that same loan will yield a rate of 6-8% because a used car is considered more high-risk than a person buying a new car....Really if someone wants a snake financed put it on your credit card and pay it off as you can...And if your credit line won't hold it maybe they should re-consider their purchase..

Points taken and well made, BUT, who says you would have to insure the BP? If you got some time of loan that required collateral who is to say it would have to be the snake?

I realize that an equity loan, or second mortgage on your home would ultimatley be the best way to go because interest can be deduct.

BUT, if you take your spider morph example, and you worked into your calculation the fact that you would breed the animal vs. keep it for fun. Why on earth would you allow it to be repo'd to buy a cheaper one? Thus ruining credit, and losing a year. If you buy a spider today, and breed the heck out of it, you should be able to pay it off in a years time, even at whatever next year's market rates are. I can't imagine them dropping any lower than an albino, or pastel for that matter. Breed 5 females get 4 eggs a each, hatch out 50% spiders (10) and sell for $3,000 each still puts you up roughly $13k this time next year with the animal paid off. Who cares what percent 7 or 10 or 12 you are paying for interest.

But on a credit card, unless you have perfect credit and low rates, why would you do it that way versus a conventional type of loan of some sort?
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0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons
0.2 Normal Adult ball pythons (on breeding loan)
0.1 Sub-adult
1.0 Normal ball python
1.1 Bell Line Pastel Ball pythons
1.0 Adult Het Albino Ball Python
1.0 Het Pied Ball Python
1.0 Het Carmel Ball Python
1.0 66% Het pied Ball python
0.2 50% Het albino Ball Pythons

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Removed advertising from signature.

Edited on June 28, 2004 at 15:36:07 by phwyvern.

Do you have any idea how many people take out a second mortgage on their homes to finance big projects or who have taken out loans on their homes just to get into this business? You have to be joking to make such a foolish statement. How many people do you know that have $25k, $40k, or $100k laying around just to dump on some snakes. But every year these animals are produced and every year they are sold, I would bet about 60% of the people borrow or find investors to aquire these animals.

as dom said there are many issues with it.

1) you would have to insure the snake, if it dies bank still wants its money; much the way when you buy a car on credit you need the best insurance or get a mortgage you need home owner's insurance. to complicate it you are dealing with a living thing that could just die so it is all the riskier making the interest rate go up (risk = higher rate) and that is compounded by the fact that the insurance on such a piece of property will be even more expensive because of the risk

2) such a variable market no one can predict what the price of any morph will be in a year. how do you know that breeder x hasn't been secrectly producing 5000 of morph a,b,c,d,e,f,g and plans to sell everyone of them make his money then move on to another species after having virtually crashed the market, if the market crashes your snake will make you no money so why not default

3) what to do with repod animal, needs to be cared for and how do you repo an animal or stop the person from just up a selling the animal and defaulting the loan. hey they get lots of free money. bank can't really prove where the animal went. there is no title or deed that is needed to sell an animal, the idea wouldn't really work even if there was

4) financing of living things is very risky

and on a side note personal loans are very difficult to get and you have to have nearly perfect credit, and a pretty good income stream, even then it is limited to tops of $10,000. interest rates on an animal would probably be worst than the interest on a credit card. if you can't get a credit card with the limit no one else is going to give you that kind of money with out colateral.
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Peace
Derek

I see you have 1.1 Bell line pastels, do you have his phone number? I appreciate it! How do they look?

Thanks!

... then talk about loans.

All these people saying you shouldn't be thinking about buying these animals until you can pay cash for them have either been born into money or have forgotten what it is like to live like the average american does. I am in the military and I have no way to purchase the high end stuff. My best suggestion is to find a private individual that has the money desired. I did this with an associate and I made a ten year contract with her starting with the first year that all my snakes started producing offspring. My vision was towards burms and tics but the consept will be the same for any morph. She was to give me $40,000 and I was going to puchase 25 snakes (all the burm morphs and most of the proven tic morphs) from this I was going to pay her back 35% of sales for ten years. Now if you look at the numbers even with depreciation you could easily make your investor a millionaire in ten years and set yourself for life also. Unfortunately, she came down with a serious medical problem and had to put a hold on all major financial transactions. If you put forth the effort and make a solid plan then the right people will be interested. Todd

Become a millionaire breeding snakes? That part was not serious was it? Supply and demand is going to bring prices down fast, especially as the market grows. Little breeders who just want the fast cash can easily sell visual morphs for half of what others sell them for. I know that is what I would do. Not have to worry about it for months, sell cheap and get rid of them in days. You still make money without the hassel. Won't be long until pastels are the same price as normals.

In all honasty millions over a ten year period is not that far out of the question when dealing with burms and retics that have large clutches. Here is what I figured. I average offspring using a punnet square and I averaged clutch sizes low. 24 for burms and 35 for retics. I also established my prices far lower than the going rate to compensate for deflation. I had my albino retics being sold at $500. All the big breeders are still selling them at $2,000, so in all honasty I would be able to sell them easily for a few more years at a grand. That doubles my projected income for the albino retics. This is not even talking about the albino tigers and supers that I will be producing in a few years. It is possible but you need a plan and you need to do everything possible to lower over head,. I started raising my own feeders and once this gets going it will save thousands a year. It is possible. A little harder and more expensive with the balls but it still will work. Todd

nt