Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is the Beauty. She is a Hogg Island with brilliant coloring and a clean body. She rivals that of a HypoXHogg in appearance. Thanks Chris - I love her!
Inside:



Outside:

This, on the other hand, is the Beast I just received today. He was sold to me as a Firebelly, but I don't think that is what he is...On top of that, he was shipped in an unlined box with styro peanuts and no cool pack. The seller put the incorrect address on the label, so he had to spend the day on the truck in 90+ degree weather. He was delivered this morning. I was appalled. I have not yet notified the seller because I am seeking opinions first. I don't want to accuse without getting all my ducks in a row. Could he have reached this condition by just the strong temps he was forced to endure? Or, do you feel abuse and neglect are behind his condition? He is emaciated and weak. Here is my dilemma, if it was abuse, do I want to send him back to Hades for more? Do I want to have spent $550 on an animal that may cost that much to get up and running again? I've been in serious need of an adult Hypo male and have been unable to find one clean enough; if he is a hypo, is this my answer? I want to send him back and run in fear, but I have never sent an animal back to a bad situation...then again, I've never spent so much on a sick looking animal.
Please go to http://www.picturetrail.com/starlight_specialties to see more pics of either of them. Before you comment on the male, PLEASE view all his other pics to make the most informed opinion.

Do you think he is hypo or just obscenely colored??

Thank you for your time.
-----

HEY LAURA
By the looks of it that animal looks to be a hypo.No Way is that animal a firebelly!!! If that is what you were led to believe for you to make the trade then you were definatly mislead. As to what to do about it? Personally i would not send my animal to someone who sent me a animal tha looks like that. I would say follow your heart on this one

I didn't trade for him, I paid $550 for him. I would not have purchased him had I known he was in this shape.
-----

Laura I would think that surely is a Hypo and has more Central American attributes to it.

Not all Firebellies show extreme Firebellies, in my experience, so there is the slight chance this is a hypo firebelly (maybe offspring from a colombian hypo bred to a firebelly boa) that is not showing much of the firebelly color.

Some people actually believe ALL Hondurans and Costa Ricans and more are ALL Firebellies! Meanwhile, it is a select form of the Hondurans from the Bahia Islands.

It could also be a plain jane high colored central too!
I'm NOT the best when it comes to distinguishing from hypo and non-hypo, great colored centrals... many of them seem to have the excess reds, especially around the tail.

So, he definately looks emaciated! Chances are, he was not fed and was pushed through breeding season to try to take advantage of his full potential, then he didn't bounce back quick enough, or he didn't get the job done, and now they are trying to get rid of him before he becomes their casualty. This is just MY OPINION.

Considering he is a central american hypo, he is worth more than you paid.
I may try to get him to a vet either way, even if he is rehydrated and feeds well, just to make sure.
My decision would come after this is done.

My desicion of not doing future business with that seller would have already been made.

I'd rather place him somewhere else with the proper care, and take this as a $500 lesson, than worry and fret and deal with all the problems that will probably arrise from trying to return him and get a refund. again, just my opinion.

Just my $.02

take care, Joe
-----
Thanks and take care - Joe Rollo
'Tis not the stongest of the species that will eventually survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change' Charles Darwin

about the size of a man's wrist(smaller than a soda can).
-----

Hello

Glad to see he arrived alive.... unfortunately not in the best shape...

I would agree with some of your responses, regarding he could possibly be a 'firebelly' but I would say he is hypo...

Needs alot of TLC. Sounds like you can give it to him. Depending on the (relationship) you have with the seller, I would talk to him and let him know how you feel about the health condition he is in. I don't know if you want to question his firebelly gene... you don't want to offend him, you wanna let him know how you feel about the transaction and that you have the support of alot of people here on KS that is aware of his condition and maybe he can assist with the Vet bill in checking his health. If he is compitent of his replies and guarantees his health, than he should have no problem putting his rep on the line to back up his transaction with you not to mention future possible dealings with him and any potential buyers you can send his way. Remember, it's not what you say - it's how you say it!

If he becomes difficult, then ask him for a refund on the shipping fees as it was his mistake that caused a day in delay.

Hope he becomes your prince charming in the end. He appears to be going into shed and should look even better in the end. Please take more pictures after his shed.

(just my opinion- nothing more)

Take care
Maggie

First, let me say your girl is lovely!

In regards to the male, I want to first say that I know nothing about the firebellies but would agree that he definitely looks hypo to me. He also looks underfed (a long term condition IMO) and possibly dehydrated (easily could have come from the shipping incident), both are fairly simple fixes though. I tend to agree with whoever it was that suggested he'd probably been used for breeding and not fattened up afterwards before being sold. One of the males I have will often go off feed - whether I use him for breeding on a specific year or not - and is still going through his re-beefing period because I prefer to put the weight back on my animals gradually rather than with heavy feeding after breeding season. Even so, he's no where near as thin as your guy. It's obvious the snake isn't in the condition you were led to believe but for myself I would be reluctant to send him back...especially since he IS a lovely colored snake to fit into a breeding project. This probably goes without saying (preaching to the choir and all that) but I'd quarantine him for at least six months, preferably a year. I would not be reluctant to contact the seller and let him know what I thought of the condition the snake is in, the lack of care taken in shipping, and request recompensation for any vet bills. Best of luck whatever your decision. And if you keep him, I'd love to see post-shed pictures.

Raven

"i just got him up from burmation that is why he looks so thin he will eat for you live rats if not then i will refund $75 dollars to you in 2 wks time if he doesn't eat for you but i know he will"

Let me think...
1.) Basically this tells me he had the boa in his care for some time...
2.) He brumated (oops "burmated" a hypo...that usually means months w/o food...I wonder if he had water? Why would he "burmate" a BCI?
3.)He doesn't apparently have the funds to pay me back, so returning him is mute point, if I had decided to go that way. If he has something wrong, $75 couldn't begin to cover what the costs could be...(I really did not bargain to spend hundreds on an animal I may have to spend hundreds on to save. I hate that people can get away with this.)
4.) Between the packaging and the care issues..I would hazard a guess that says he doesn't much know what he is doing...I hope he learns soon.

Your thoughts on this matter?
-----

>>Your thoughts on this matter?
>>-----
>>

Wellllllllll..........

1) The snake is in his care for some time.....obviously, given the condition of the snake, he doesn't know how to properly keep Bci then.

2) He brumated the snake. Well, I don't know of anyone who actually brumates Bci...that's more of a colubrid thing. On the other hand, you do cool Bci prior to breeding (usually in the fall/winter)...but not to the point of true brumation, or for this long and not at this time of year. Even if the snake was a colubrid, it should have been brought out of brumation in January or February. We can only hope water was provided but given the known track record, I wouldn't bet on anything.

3) I'd recommend the seller send the $75 now...it's irrelevant if the snake will or will not eat in two weeks time. Your payment should never have been spent until you let him known you were satisfied with the animal. You paid several hundred dollars for a healthy snake and got one that will need extra TLC and possibly medical care. On that note, does he show any signs of an RI? If not (and I would think you would have mentioned it if he did), I still am of the opinion that proper husbandry and feeding will soon remedy the known physical problems. A visit to your vet will determine if there is anything else to be concerned about (hopefully not). At least the $75 should cover the office part of the vet visit.

4) Yeah, I'm afraid that given what you've shared here, the seller isn't exactly knowledgable about Bci care or how to properly ship a live animal.

On a closing note, it wouldn't hurt to get word out to other boa enthusiasts about this seller (obviously not on this site). Best of luck with your new guy and keep us (read me! ) updated on his condition.

Raven

Well, I agree...

I would also (after requesting the $75 now) send him a link to this post so he knows you are getting the word out about him.

He should have no problem in getting you $75 since the money you sent - he should still have...

But I agree that his problems look physical and hopefully as time passes he will become a valuable addition to your family.

Please post some pix after shed and in a couple of months to show his progress....

Maggie

Laura,

I know everyone has commented on this but, here's my say as well. ;D (I know I know, everyone is now waiting with baited breath for my next novel).

I appluad you for keeping this boa (he's a smoker too! or at least will be after shedding and getting some water and food into him).

I am angry to see yet again we have another person who is apparently severely unqualified to care for an animal and STILL tries to make a profit from it. I too agree you should request he send the mere $75 now and also what your total thoughts are on this and that you will be taking the animal to the vet and he should reimburse you for ALL veterinary costs should anything come up wrong with your snake.
If anyone sends out an animal and the customer is NOT happy, they should refund their money. If the animal is sick, the owner should have the option to send it back for a full refund or keep it and have their vet bills paid for in full.

Please keep us posted on how this little guy progresses. Got my good luck fingers crossed for his recovery.

Hugs!

Amanda Rose

I hate that happened to you and I do not think seventy five is near enough...