Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Each new breeding season seems to produce something new and different(with any luck!).Looking for abbarancies here,please post pics with history,thanks,Jeff

These came from a wild caught female found just south of Lake Okeechobee earlier this year. She was gravid when found and laid 8 eggs almost a month after I had her. Here she is:

Only six eggs hatched and this was the first snake to emerge.

And the second aberrant one.

Same aberrant one next to a normal from the same clutch.

So far all but one normal are eating frozen thawed pinkies. Four took unscented f/t from the get go and the first aberrant one needed a scented pinky on it's first meal but took an unscented pinky on it's next.

Is that a stinking hybrid?

kk

That is a cross,hypo brooks X goini-f2.J

Brooksi X goini and you don't consider that a hybrid? Ahhh I see the old "gulf coast" school of thought.

You probably aren't alone though, many others consider polyzona x hondurensis and getula getula x getula nigra to be pure also. *shrug*

What ever floats your boat but hybrid/intergrade kings don't impress me.

Keep em pure or don't keep em at all is my philosophy.

kk

I just think if they occur in NATURE that they should never be considered a hybrid.Honestly representing and pictures eliminate alot of possible confusion.They arent bad to look at either,Jeff

getula and nigra have a very large overlapping range. They integrade quite extensively and they are not a hybrid. Same goes with getula X apalachicola(?) and nigra X holbrooki. Lots of sub-species overlap and breed regularly in the wild and produce offspring with traits of each sub. Again, not starting a war here, just stating the facts on your comment on the nigra/getula cross.

Brandon Osborne

getula and nigra have a very large overlapping range. They integrade quite extensively and they are not a hybrid.

If heard that quite a bit but have never seen photos. Do you have any pics of said intergrades since they have such a large overlapping range?

Again, not starting a war here, just stating the facts on your comment on the nigra/getula cross.

No problem, I understand where you are coming from. I was taking a cheap jab at some recent ads for "pure" amel eastern chain kings... lol. I think we all know the real history behind those animals, guess its like beating a dead horse eh?

Thanks for your comments.

kk

It's funny you mention the amel eastern because there were some amel nigra available from Tom Crutchfield about 8 or 9 years ago. One of the said strains of amel eastern was supposed to come from Crutchfield, only I never saw them on his price list. Besides that, I don't consider them to be worth $100 ea. much less $1000 ea. when they were first made available......but that's just my opinion. I like morphs, and I think some deserve the price asked, but I also think some are extremely overpriced. We're all just partial to what we like, and that's what make eveyones' opinoin, just that.....an opinion.

Sorry I don't have any pics of the integrades. Some old herp friends of mine that used to hunt state to state alomst every week found some that looked like both eastern and nigra in eastern KY and eastern OH. Just as some of the kings from SW Illinois and MO resemble nigra and holbrooki.....and I've caught these myself. Sorry no pics. I haven't hunted in years, and it was way before digital cameras.

Brandon Osborne

Jeff

Ive mentioned this to you before but I guess you forgot but Apalachicola Kings (Goini if you will) dont intergrade with Floridana. Goini is surrounded by Eastern Kings. So its an unnatural intergrade but not as unnatural as some like Cal X Eastern cross etc...

Keith
-----