Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is the pic of the t.p. copper I found while alterna hunting between alpine and ter. I said I would post it sooner or later so here it is.

Sweet Pictigaster!!

Great photo. What a beauty. Was this down in the Christmas?

Hey everyone. How often are these still being seen (I know, I know, this is the alterna forum...) on 118??? They used to be frequently encountered around Luna Vista (70's, early 80's), but it seems with the drought and road construction they are not being seen as much??? Just curious. Thanks, Hugh

Hey Hugh. I have not seen one myself in thirty or forty nights of looking in the last two years but a friend of mine did see one while walking a cut on Luna Vista a couple of weeks ago. But then according to my notes from 1986 the number of snakes encountered period is down 55 to 60%. Go figure!

I was down there in mid june and saw one just south of alpine AOR. They are beautiful snakes!
chris

( kind of long )
on why some think there is low numbers observed between the first year you posted and now. How about the EXPLOSION of the eastern part of the trans pecos ? The driven mainstay of hunters are definitely not going to regions of the west. ( is this what we are talking about > ? )While most folks states that there are more herps to be seen out west, it seems they are not into the various species in numbers or whatever the west has to offer. You know, and i know what these herpers are looking for ! Now don't flame me folks but we all know that finding alterna in the eastern part is a lot easier whether we are talking numbers or less time consuming as far as actual time spent. So more mass hunting in a given area = more herps seen. With the locale of 277 being the very MOST popular area because of what has been found there in the past 15 years ( maybe a little farther back )I would venture to say that 277 has seen more hunters than ANYPLACE else of west Texas. I would say this is a fact. It has only been recently that 277 has slowed down and Juno is back in the minds of hunters and of course some parts of 90 has always been semi-popular. Also look at statistics of around Sanderson in the past several years. Several of us knows people that MIGHT give the west a chance but they kind of "puss" out with only one night or 2 at the most and it's back to the east. I agree that it wasn't that way in the middle 80ties ! Also just maybe it has something to do with the past drought in the west but you can't really convince me of this. People say that the eastern part hasn't changed in climatic conditions in the past 20 years as oppose to the west. I don't know..........
Details of my last visit soon.

m chambers

Nice post, and very true about who spends what hours where, but what I am asking is, doesn't it seem that copperhead sightings on 118 have dropped off considerably in the last decade?? Hour to hour comparison seem to indicate that from my records, but it isn't really a statistically significant sample to say anything. I was just curious if the herpers who continue to work 118 would agree? I would even venture to say it's true for the river road as well. They are still thick in the canyons in the cane, but I wonder about elsewhere??

a lack of pics on R.R. for me at least. Maybe I will agree on 118 though. In general you and others might be right of your observation/s. But it hasn't gone that way for me. It IS though a mystery to me on how many pics, lepidus, and even sightings of trimorphs that I see/find compared to alterna. But maybe that's GOOD because i'm not a fan of alterna ! Other than we always hear about when some of those " other " species are out so are alterna. Well, on this last trip, alterna was mingling with subocs, atroxes and everything else. I do know of maybe another alterna found south of where I was. Someone else where I was thought they had a alterna but turned out to be a emorys. LOL ! I told them that I would post this but not names ( they were REAL newbies ). It was small and had a weird head shape to it. Well..that's what you get for being 17 and not real familar with species from other states. They DID get see alternas several days later and lep, and pic and subocs.

I looked back at my notes from 1985 and 1986 and compared them to 03 and 04 and they do reflect a drastic decline in numbers in general. Not any one species or subspecies that I can see at a glance. However, I will agree with HKM in that there seems to be fewer pics on Luna Vista. The majority of the ones seen in the past two years have been along the river,i.e.rock house, or near the Colorodo Canyon put in and that stretch of road between Fresno Creek and the Big Hill, all with easy access to water as opposed to Luna Vista with no water and more likely affected by the drought.

Not necessarily my opinion but more of a question. Ain't that science?

Later, Big White Truck

I mean that in a very humorous way, relating to you being the BIG WHITE TRUCK that we all was talking about ! Are you really the one in that truck ? I will definite agree on the pics coming from the more accessable water areas with meaning the more or higher humidity in the areas that we are talking about. River Road for sure at certain areas has been most of my finds in the past several years. Where that creek runs south of Alpine that has water in it far longer then most about 10-15 miles south has been another area that I have found them. And some other places that I can't realy pin-point at this time. I'm glad you got me thinking about this. I only wonder the effect ,for awhile, of all the rain of west Texas will have on species for the next X amount of time seeing that the rain fall has surpassed anything in the past 7 or 10 or so years ? And oh, it is announced and written that Mr. Smith has bought parts of 170 road at Lajitas !

m chambers

So Mike, when do we get a report and/or photos of your last trip?? Glad you could make it through the "force field" that must exist at the Terrel/Brewster county line!! Anymore amazing orange subocs? If you don't want to post here about your trip, email me.Lol.

He is a terdy, and an old one at that, but being as I am older I have to say that that part of him he wears well!!

Well, you guys are sort of saying what I said in the the first post: maybe pic observations are a little off on Luna Vista, and maybe that is due to the drought and the construction etc.

And Rick, saying what I already said in your post like you said it is science at it's best!! LOL!! I forwarded your last email to Big White Feet regarding your alterna sex numbers etc...

And Mike, yes he is big white truck. We've been laughing about that all summer. I was the little green car parked with him earlier in the summer when you guys began asking about it. And the game wardens were stopping us, not the reverse!!! Too funny.

Hope you both are well!! H