Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Actualy, this is my second experience with white lipped pythons. The first was a pair of golden/brown phase. They were absolutely vicious. I did not enjoy working with them, so I traded them. But I have kept my pair of black phase, as they are much easier to work with.

They seem to be perfect in every way, eating, growing, shedding, and crapping. But when they crap, not always, they have what looks like diahrea. And they have saliva or mucus seeping out of their mouths. They have been this way since day one. But they seem otherwise very healthy, and strong. Very strong! I know from experience that all species are different, as far as things like this go, but I am wondering if they should go to the vet, or does this sound normal for them.

Also, any tips on temps, thermal gradients, cage set-ups, or any husbandry methods for this speceies would be greatly appreciated! They are gorgious animals, and I would like to do everything I can to dial in perfection before I go running to the vet. Often times, problems can be resolved just by giving optimal conditions. So If I know what they are, I will provide them.

Right now they are in huge clear plastic sweater boxes. Each with a big water bowl, a hide box, and a desert rays heat pannel on the back wall, which is controled by a digital proportional thermostat with about a six hour night drop of about 5 degrees. The hot side is low 90s, the cool side is low 80s the rest of the time. The hide box runs all the way across the thermal gradient, so they can still thermoregulate while inside the hide. Substrate is newspaper. They boost their own humidity by crawling through the water, and dripping it all over the cage. They are beautiful, but sloppy!

Now,...where can I make improvements? Thanks a bunch,
Tony-thesnakeman-Carlisle.

so stay tuned!

Cheers,
Wulf
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http://www.leiopython.de ,
http://www.herpers-digest.com

Hi there,

But when they crap, not always, they have what looks like diahrea.

This seems to be quite normal in both races of wlps.

And they have saliva or mucus seeping out of their mouths. They have been this way since day one.

Some wlps do before going into blue or priour to mating. Other situations where you can observe this are when being stressed by something. Not all wlps do so, but I've observed this in some specimens on a regular base.

But they seem otherwise very healthy, and strong. Very strong! I know from experience that all species are different, as far as things like this go, but I am wondering if they should go to the vet, or does this sound normal for them.

Right, individuals are all different, but there is obviously some sort of specific behaviour that can be observed in many wlps. It is not really normal, but it can be seen sometimes in some specimens. But if you have worries, you should perhaps visit a vet to get your wlp checked.

When using newspaper as substrate you could perhaps provide a hide box with damp moss, where the wlp can lay into. The rest of the caging and climate conditions sounds ok to me. Usually wlps that have not settled down yet tend to dive under the water bowl, spill it all over the cage and sometimes will also sleep beneath it. This behaviour should stopp after a while, when the wlp starts using hiding places provided. If it doesn't you should check the hiding places and perhaps look at the temps in the cage.

That's all for now.

Cheers,
Wulf

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http://www.leiopython.de
http://www.herpers-digest.com
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http://www.leiopython.de ,
http://www.herpers-digest.com

Thanks man,
They do love their hide boxes! I don't see them unless I take them out or go in the snake room with a flash light at night.

I realy enjoy them when I do take them out. They are so very beautiful. They are more indigo than my indigos! And the black phasers are so much easier to work with. They are settleing down nicely. They are larger than the goldens, but much more docile. HOWEVER, they still command a certain degree of caution, and respect! The female has taken a blood sample from me, when I first got them!

I had them both out today, for a little sunshine, and exersise. I treated them gently, and they where reciprocal. The salivation, or mouth mucus seemed to be almost non-existant today. It seems to be going away. I think with continued proper husbandry, they will continue to improve in that respect.

What is an optimum cage size/dimmension? They are pushing seven ft. and are very active at night. How big will these babies get.
I'm guessing around 10 ft., that about right? How big is big enough for breeding?

Any good websites with good care sheets on these guys would also be greatly appreciated. I think I'm doing o.k. for them, but I do want to learn all I can, in order to make their environment as close to perfect as possible. Thanks very much,
T.

Hi there,

the golden as well as the black wlps are very alert snakes that tend to be territorial. I guess the biggest problem is to get them out of the cage. After they are successfully taken out of the cage they both will calm down very quick and can be handled quite good. Well, you mentioned it, they are very very strong so I might need some muscles to get them where you want them to be

The salivation occurs in some specimens golden and black and can easily be taken for respiratory infections.
I've discussed that in my forum quite a while ago:

http://www.leiopython.de/webboard/read.php?board=2&id=43

And there you can read that others have made same experiences.

Size of the black wlps is up to 10 ft, with an average of about 8-8.5 ft. Some specimens grow a bit larger, but only a few reach the 10 ft. The average size of the golden ones is about 6-6.5 ft, with only few growing larger than 7 ft.

You mentioned it, they are very active at night. Therefore an enclosure of at least 5 x 2 x 3 ft would be minimum for max. two adult black wlps. The more you give them, the better for them! There is nothing like a to big cage with these pythons. They will check out every inch of the enclosure and will definitly find every error in cage construction or overseen holes. These guys love to climb so if you provide perches, stong enought to carry their weight, they will be gladly appreciated by the pythons. But watch out! They often fall down without hurting themselves, but you should take care that nothing beneath the perches could harm them. Just be safe on this!
In my experience it is also a need to secure all bulbs and other stuff where they could coil around and get burned or hurt themselves in any way!

Breeding them is a problem on its own. First you have to have a compatible pair. Definitly not all 1.1 or 2.1 will mate! But if they do they should be at least 6 ft in length and in good condition. There are different reports on when they mature. I would say at about the age of 5 years.
Place the female into the male's cage in late November and watch. You can perhaps leave them together until April if you can't recognize the female is gravid. You shouldn't feed them during that period as this could end up with one constricting the other. You should see signs of gravity from February to June. Neonates are larger than the ones from the golden with an average size of about 50 cm (~1.5 ft ?).

If you are looking for a web site dealing with wlps, feel free to visit my site at www.leiopython.de

Cheers,
Wulf
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http://www.leiopython.de ,
http://www.herpers-digest.com

Hey thanks alot man,
Where in Europe are you? I was in Germany a short while in 1995.

Yes these are very alert animals, and very good eye sight. I take them outto exersise and deficate in the yard. I carry them out while they are still hiding in their hide box. Them I set the box down in one place and carry the snakes to a spot a good distance away, and they can spot that box, and go right to it. Today, th efemale went almost a hundred feet, {not sure how many meters}. She zeroed right in on it from that far away.

They are fasciating creatures, and I would strongly recomend them to anyone with a little experience. They are not good snakes for kids, or the inexperienced, but for anyone who has been keeping snakes for a few years, they would make a great addition to the collection. Keep in mind that they MUST be treated very gently, and with great respect, and they will reciprocate in kind. But if you are not experienced, careful, and very gentle, they will light you up in a heartbeat! And in the sun light, yhey are absolutely gorgious!
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"No tree would have branches foolish enough to argue amonst themseleves".

Hi there,

I live in Bonn, Germany's ex-capitol city.

It's funny, if you ask people what they think about wlps, they all say "look great, but to aggressive", but if people get some there is only "great animals" left

I love these animals, too and will propobly stick to wlps for the rest of my life.

Cheers,
Wulf
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http://www.leiopython.de ,
http://www.herpers-digest.com