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For Mark about mertensi, from below

FR Aug 21, 2004 01:38 PM

Mark posted this in a discussion with Rsg.

mark wrote,


Posted by: mequinn at Fri Aug 20 22:34:51 2004 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]

Terrestrial-based Australian varanids go through a climatic dry and wet period, as you probably know. In 'wild' During the dry season, the terrestrial Varanids (i.e. V. gouldii, V. acanthurus) have a drop in body weight, and a gain of body weight in the wet season; the reverse is known for V. mertensi as it drops body weight in the dry season and gains body weight in the wet season, as V. mertensi does not brumate/hibernate/ dormancy and is active year-round. Its water -uptake is significantly higher than its terrestrial counterparts in both the wet and dry seasons (Christian, 1996. Energetics and water flux in a semiaquatic lizard Varanus mertensi. Copeia (2):354-362) - does this not 'suggest' they require more water than a terrestrial species, and when available will hydrate themselves whenever possible, i.e. bathing/soaking?? It does to me....

So where did I miss your point? You say V. mertensi "prefer" swimming/in the wet than do V. acanthurus - does'nt that mean they require it?? Preference is a choice issue, and V. mertensi do not go swimming for 'fun'? They do this to thermoregulate, hydrate, and stablelize metabolic processes with the addition/deletion of water, which is crucial to their metabolic functions. Some varanids require more water than others, have lower optimal body temps than others (i.e. V. salvator's 85F), hence its constant use or "preference" for soaking/swimming = it does this because it has too, and not for mere enjoyment/pleasure. Varanids are reptiles, and reptiles I do not think they have 'joy'(pleasure, ectasy etc..) in their innate or learned behavior categories. They "prefer" to soak because they have to to sustain their metabolic functions for an animal where they are in the water more than a V. acanthurus. V. acanthurus have adapted through time and genetics to maintain a higher water content in their physiology than V. mertensi, hence they retain their water more efficiently, vrs. V. mertensi which does not but is always associated with water, in water, around water a majority of the time on an annual basis....one does not have to keep varanids to understand this...this is where knowledge of an animal can be important to a herp keeper to know something about the animals in their keep to know which ones 'prefer' aquatic, semi-aquatic, terrestrial, arboreal, habitats and adjust their terraria to them....and where many animals die as they do not understand or grasp this primary requirement to successful husbandry (not necessarily to you, but others reading this)...
mbayless

While this sounds great, I have several questions.

Have you been to australia and seen these monitors doing this stuff? put answer here.

Do you understand, that ackies occurr from the very top of oz, 7 degrees off the equator, to south of the tropic line. They occur in deserts without a rainy season, that freezes. They occur all the way to the very top in habitats that are tropical to semi tropical and have a wet and dry season. They also occur in the pilbara, that has no distint rainy season,(overflow from both north and south), thats very hot and arid. So your comparison is very weak, as V.mertensi, only occurs in the topend and avoids freezing weather(only lite freezes) V.mertensi, commonly estavates in the dry season, as the billibogs dry up, as most do. In very dry years, they may spend the better part of a year underground. Mertens in the Mt. Isa area to the Halls Creek area, can and do experience prolonged dry periods with absolutely no water.

Before you make your comments, you should research more. or at least go visit. Thanks FR

Replies (5)

mequinn Aug 21, 2004 05:10 PM

You again did not read the post clearly: Go back and read it again....V. mertensi feed constantly throughout the year, whether wet or dry period, and unlike V. acanthurus or V. gouldii, have a greater requirment for water than do the two others, as they do estivate/brumate/hibernate, and V. mertensi does not....I do not need to visit Australia, as I have the information right in from of me from Keith Christian. Why don't you ask him yourself - He is a very nice fellow...and can explain it far better than I did - but some of it will above your depth of knowledge as it involves chemistry and computations and so on...it is related to diet and feeding on an annual basis, and some of that stuff is complicated sometimes... if you care to follow through with it of course....and with regards to where and what I post, I will post where and when I wish too, and not otherwise, thank you. You act as thought this is your forum? Oh yeah, I forgot, it is....hahahahahaha
mbayless

FR Aug 21, 2004 05:22 PM

But I am indeed asking you, not him. I am sure his information is accurate for a certain area, you know, around Darwin. But it does not apply to Mt.Isa and Halls Creek mertens. Of course there are many other populations it does not apply to as well. I am sure, he would be the first to recognize this. I also believe, that he did not intend to have his paper represent all mertens. You see, I find no problem with his work, its only you thinking it represents all mertens. It doesn't. Ring em up and ask.

You see Mark, I have been there and I have seen mertens from the north, south and east and west. I have also seen them in different seasons. I have seen them brumate in the dry in some areas, and stay active in others(topend and the kimberly)

Also, if you want to discuss this farther, you should understand that in many places, the billibogs hold large concentrations of frogs and fish, in the dry, providing a great oppertunitity for some lucky individuals an excess of food. But, thats not the point either.

Again, you fail to respond in any notable fashion. Mark, why can't you stand on your own two feet?

So you have not seen them for yourself. Hmmmmmmmmmm Nice, FR

mequinn Aug 21, 2004 05:30 PM

The animals, V. mertensi were collected and studied from Lake Bennett, 80 km South of Darwin, close to Pine creek area.

The data is clear, but you seem to refuse to acknolwegde it as a actual physiological response of V. mertensi to its environment - when you have shown me/proven to me they do otherwise at Mt. Isa, then I will take note of it...were you at Mt. Isa long enough to see them engage in estivation/brumation/hibernation behaviors? Do you have proof of this, more-so than your word? Perhaps some data of some kind to demonstrate they do this there?
Something more concrete? When you do, I would like to learn of it.
mbayless

FR Aug 21, 2004 06:41 PM

I not only agreed with the author, I told you where the study was from, by the description of the mertens. I had not read that paper. I know the animals. You should be impressed.

Remember I said in the previous post,


Posted by: FR at Sat Aug 21 17:22:11 2004 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]

But I am indeed asking you, not him. I am sure his information is accurate for a certain area, you know, around Darwin.

Pine Creek is in the topend, close to darwin.

What you miss is, mertens from other areas with different weather and conditions, do entirely different things. But I guess you will have to wait for a paper to know. FR

mequinn Aug 21, 2004 09:13 PM

What you miss is, mertens from other areas with different weather and conditions, do entirely different things. But I guess you will have to wait for a paper to know. FR

Yes, I did not read your reply as attentive as I should have - Tell me more about this then since you have seen them do tis in the Mt. Isa region? How long were you there to know this behavior/physiology? Is it like V. niloticus then? Please give me some details, and I will take a look at it...
thanks,
mbayless

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